Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Gene » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:21 pm

Sangoma wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 4:13 pm
Wrong forum.

Gene, in spite of some grammatical errors the mood is conveyed very well. Russian sailors would say, not good for a foreigner.

I mean, NOT BAD for a foreigner!
Thanks, Sangoma. I'm still learning. There are Russian women at work so I am not working on Mat.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Gene » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:31 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:15 am
Gene wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:24 pm

турд, ты закрываешь тоя пизда, ешь дерьмо и умраешь. ты суха пиза блядь,

турд фергосан блядь.
Please continue to put all future posts in a language o neither understand nor have a desire to read.
Иди на хуи, Турд суха бладь. Ебаю товя Мамы, Турд. Ебаю тои Папу, Турд. Буду ебать Ты как Женщина и будешь любить меня, Турд.
Last edited by Gene on Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Gene » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:52 pm

Sure love to know exactly what the Russians did that let Trump win. If we have degenerated to the point that the Wikileaked emails are the culprit then we're punishing the Russians for snitching.

Are we that degenerate today, that we punish people who tell the truth?
Data talks, bullshit walks.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:02 pm
Thud wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:49 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:19 pm
But if you are trying to assign moral culpability, my opinion is it lies 100% with the parents who are making their children the victims of their illegal entry into the USA.
Bullshit, on the moral equivalence. Migration to fill jobs and better your family is not the equivalent of orphaning children. It's like saying an 8 year old deserves to get shot if he's caught shoplifting a candy bar. It's not morally defensible. People only say shit like that when they're talking about brown/black kids.
An orphan is a child who's parents are dead. Nobody's orphaning anybody so calm down, and as for false equivalences, nobody's shooting shoplifters either. You've got a bit of a delirious posting style. People who enter this, or any, country illegally are committing a crime. Done en masse, it is an invasion. If they just want to "fill jobs and better their family" they'll have to do it elsewhere or apply for legal immigration status like everybody else.
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by nafod » Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:17 pm

Gene wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:52 pm
Sure love to know exactly what the Russians did that let Trump win. If we have degenerated to the point that the Wikileaked emails are the culprit then we're punishing the Russians for snitching.

Are we that degenerate today, that we punish people who tell the truth?
The Russians committed a crime of hacking into the Dem email accounts, a break-in same as Watergate, and then using Wikileaks to spill them. And the Russians took advantage of social media and mindless followers, posting reams of totally made up bullshit using fake accounts that were slurped up and “liked” by the mindless. Etc. Pretty clear they’ve got kompromat on The Orange One.
Don’t believe everything you think.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Fat Cat » Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm

Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Wild Bill » Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:07 am

nafod wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:17 pm
Russians took advantage of social media and mindless followers, posting reams of totally made up bullshit using fake accounts that were slurped up and “liked” by the mindless.
=D>
Nafod, can you provide some examples of those "reams of totally made up bullshit"?
Two exampes wil be enough :)
I am sinscirely interestin, what kind of FB posts seduced steadfast Americans to vote for Put... i mean Trump.

Seriously, post two examples please :)

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Wild Bill » Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:11 am

BTW, you really believe that Russians did not use such technologies before?
Or that Americans do not use such technologies on Russia?
Or you so pissed of just because Russians were successful? :)))

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by nafod » Sun Aug 19, 2018 1:45 pm

Wild Bill wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:07 am
nafod wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:17 pm
Russians took advantage of social media and mindless followers, posting reams of totally made up bullshit using fake accounts that were slurped up and “liked” by the mindless.
=D>
Nafod, can you provide some examples of those "reams of totally made up bullshit"?
Two exampes wil be enough :)
There’s some good stuff out there. My favorite was the Heart of Texas secessionist group.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dem ... 48a5c56e79
In early 2016, while researching some of the most popular U.S. secession groups online, I stumbled across one of the Russian-controlled Facebook accounts that were then pulling in Americans by the thousands.

At the time, I was writing on Russia’s relationship with American secessionists from Texas, Hawaii and Puerto Rico. These were people who had hitched flights to Moscow to swap tactics, to offer advice and to find support. They had found succor in the shadow of the Kremlin.

That was how I eventually found my way to the “Heart of Texas” Facebook page (and its @itstimetosecede Twitter feed as well). Heart of Texas soon grew into the most popular Texas secession page on Facebook — one that, at one point in 2016, boasted more followers than the official Texas Democrat and Republican Facebook pages combined. By the time Facebook took the page down recently, it had a quarter of a million followers.
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If you are arguing that there are a lot of mouth breathing Americans who slurp this shit up, I am agreeing with you.
Don’t believe everything you think.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Turdacious » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:03 pm

nafod wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:17 pm
Gene wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:52 pm
Sure love to know exactly what the Russians did that let Trump win. If we have degenerated to the point that the Wikileaked emails are the culprit then we're punishing the Russians for snitching.

Are we that degenerate today, that we punish people who tell the truth?
The Russians committed a crime of hacking into the Dem email accounts, a break-in same as Watergate, and then using Wikileaks to spill them. And the Russians took advantage of social media and mindless followers, posting reams of totally made up bullshit using fake accounts that were slurped up and “liked” by the mindless. Etc. Pretty clear they’ve got kompromat on The Orange One.
Their support for Stein was probably more effective as a tactic.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:48 pm

Trump/Roger Stone/Alex Jones are masterful demagogues. Truly, credit where due.
But the Russians know a thing or two about propaganda as well.
Match made in heaven. Or hell...
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Turdacious » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:34 pm

Thud wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:48 pm
Trump/Roger Stone/Alex Jones are masterful demagogues. Truly, credit where due.
But the Russians know a thing or two about propaganda as well.
Match made in heaven. Or hell...
Is there any compelling evidence that the Russian interference helped Trump directly— not that they intended to help him but that their efforts actually did? Maybe there are other reasons that people who voted for Obama twice voted for Trump.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by nafod » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:01 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:34 pm
Is there any compelling evidence that the Russian interference helped Trump directly— not that they intended to help him but that their efforts actually did? Maybe there are other reasons that people who voted for Obama twice voted for Trump.
You look at the margin of victory in the key states and the impact of the stolen emails on the polls, along with the number of 'likes' that the Russian troll-bots garnered, and absolutely it had an impact. Of course it did.
Don’t believe everything you think.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm

Thud wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
I am aware that there may be some children separated from their parents. I am aware it is the parents' fault. I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.

I didn't understand the YouTube link.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:08 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:34 pm
Thud wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:48 pm
Trump/Roger Stone/Alex Jones are masterful demagogues. Truly, credit where due.
But the Russians know a thing or two about propaganda as well.
Match made in heaven. Or hell...
Is there any compelling evidence that the Russian interference helped Trump directly— not that they intended to help him but that their efforts actually did? Maybe there are other reasons that people who voted for Obama twice voted for Trump.
I think Nafod answered well. But I think it's extremely hard to quantify. It's like proving how much Alex Jones helped, though we know he did. Or Pizzagate, Comey, emails, Benghazi, or anything else.

I also think Dems are pussies when it comes to stuff like this. Think of Al Gore bowing out, with his chad hanging, for the good of the country. With the roles reversed, Repugs would have Nunez issuing reports every day about how illegitimate Hillary were. Dems are just decades behind repugs on sleeze tactics like Willie Horton, Swift Boat, Birtherism, etc. Not that they don't try. Just don't know how to lead an angry mob yet.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:50 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm
Thud wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
I am aware that there may be some children separated from their parents. I am aware it is the parents' fault. I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.

I didn't understand the YouTube link.
No need to continue with this. Some people see something vile and call it beautiful. For other's it's still not heinous enough. I get where you land.

Fortunately saner minds prevailed and demanded he relent. Pity (though beautiful to some) the hundreds they haven't and/or can't reunite.

https://americasvoice.org/press_release ... e-orphans/
As the federal judge, the George W. Bush-appointed Dana Sabraw, said at the recent status conference:

All of this is the result of the government’s separation and then inability and failure to track and reunited. And the reality is that for every parent who is not located, there will be a permanently orphaned child and that is 100 percent the responsibility of the administration.

Today’s Washington Post editorial board lays out how the administration did not collect information that would be useful at this key moment:

A measure of the administration’s callous recklessness is that officials often failed to collect contact information for deported mothers and fathers — cellphone numbers, addresses — that could facilitate reunions with their children. In some cases, government forms list deportees’ addresses in Central America as “calle sin nombre” — street without a name. Very useful.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... -easy.html
So far that experience is not going well. Some parents in detention are struggling to find their children, some of whom are being flown to places as far away from the border as Michigan. Other parents have been deported without ever learning the whereabouts of their kids. As the Houston Chronicle reports, the records kept by the various agencies with a role in this process are messy and hard to track:

Social workers struggle to find parents within the two agencies overseeing immigrant adult detention, the departments of Justice and Homeland Security. Officials in charge of children have said they are not routinely provided information about how family separations occur or where a minor’s parents may be.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by JimZipCode » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:23 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm
I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.
Because, in a display of colossal incompetence and carelessness and negligence and – I'm sputtering, running out of adjectives – the agency implementing this "policy" didn't bother tracking the names and family members of the kids they farmed out. They just took 'em and stuck 'em somewhere.

It's bewildering. I can hardly even believe it.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Fat Cat » Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:20 am

Thud wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:50 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm
Thud wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
I am aware that there may be some children separated from their parents. I am aware it is the parents' fault. I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.

I didn't understand the YouTube link.
No need to continue with this. Some people see something vile and call it beautiful. For other's it's still not heinous enough. I get where you land.

Fortunately saner minds prevailed and demanded he relent. Pity (though beautiful to some) the hundreds they haven't and/or can't reunite.

https://americasvoice.org/press_release ... e-orphans/
As the federal judge, the George W. Bush-appointed Dana Sabraw, said at the recent status conference:

All of this is the result of the government’s separation and then inability and failure to track and reunited. And the reality is that for every parent who is not located, there will be a permanently orphaned child and that is 100 percent the responsibility of the administration.

Today’s Washington Post editorial board lays out how the administration did not collect information that would be useful at this key moment:

A measure of the administration’s callous recklessness is that officials often failed to collect contact information for deported mothers and fathers — cellphone numbers, addresses — that could facilitate reunions with their children. In some cases, government forms list deportees’ addresses in Central America as “calle sin nombre” — street without a name. Very useful.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... -easy.html
So far that experience is not going well. Some parents in detention are struggling to find their children, some of whom are being flown to places as far away from the border as Michigan. Other parents have been deported without ever learning the whereabouts of their kids. As the Houston Chronicle reports, the records kept by the various agencies with a role in this process are messy and hard to track:

Social workers struggle to find parents within the two agencies overseeing immigrant adult detention, the departments of Justice and Homeland Security. Officials in charge of children have said they are not routinely provided information about how family separations occur or where a minor’s parents may be.
No need to be so spiteful. Surely we can find some common ground? As a starting point, I think we both agree that separating children from parents without any tracking or system in place to reunite them at some point is beyond crazy. Yes? Because it turns out that this program was Obama's.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/16/us/t ... icle-click

The Senate hearing came as the Trump administration was already under fire for mishandling the records of migrant families that were separated at the southwest border, which injected chaos and delays into a court-ordered effort to reunify them. It marked the end of a three-year investigation that began while President Barack Obama was still in office.

The process for handling children who travel to the United States alone — known as “unaccompanied minors” — has not changed significantly under President Trump.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Thud » Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:05 am

Fat Cat wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:20 am
Thud wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:50 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm
Thud wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
I am aware that there may be some children separated from their parents. I am aware it is the parents' fault. I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.

I didn't understand the YouTube link.
No need to continue with this. Some people see something vile and call it beautiful. For other's it's still not heinous enough. I get where you land.

Fortunately saner minds prevailed and demanded he relent. Pity (though beautiful to some) the hundreds they haven't and/or can't reunite.

https://americasvoice.org/press_release ... e-orphans/
As the federal judge, the George W. Bush-appointed Dana Sabraw, said at the recent status conference:

All of this is the result of the government’s separation and then inability and failure to track and reunited. And the reality is that for every parent who is not located, there will be a permanently orphaned child and that is 100 percent the responsibility of the administration.

Today’s Washington Post editorial board lays out how the administration did not collect information that would be useful at this key moment:

A measure of the administration’s callous recklessness is that officials often failed to collect contact information for deported mothers and fathers — cellphone numbers, addresses — that could facilitate reunions with their children. In some cases, government forms list deportees’ addresses in Central America as “calle sin nombre” — street without a name. Very useful.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... -easy.html
So far that experience is not going well. Some parents in detention are struggling to find their children, some of whom are being flown to places as far away from the border as Michigan. Other parents have been deported without ever learning the whereabouts of their kids. As the Houston Chronicle reports, the records kept by the various agencies with a role in this process are messy and hard to track:

Social workers struggle to find parents within the two agencies overseeing immigrant adult detention, the departments of Justice and Homeland Security. Officials in charge of children have said they are not routinely provided information about how family separations occur or where a minor’s parents may be.
No need to be so spiteful. Surely we can find some common ground? As a starting point, I think we both agree that separating children from parents without any tracking or system in place to reunite them at some point is beyond crazy. Yes? Because it turns out that this program was Obama's.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/16/us/t ... icle-click

The Senate hearing came as the Trump administration was already under fire for mishandling the records of migrant families that were separated at the southwest border, which injected chaos and delays into a court-ordered effort to reunify them. It marked the end of a three-year investigation that began while President Barack Obama was still in office.

The process for handling children who travel to the United States alone — known as “unaccompanied minors” — has not changed significantly under President Trump.


No Fats. No common ground, because while I may oppose the law (and it was never applied as written until Trump's zero tolerance policy) you support it, heinously applied, 100%.

You're on your own there, pal.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Turdacious » Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:45 am

nafod wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:01 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:34 pm
Is there any compelling evidence that the Russian interference helped Trump directly— not that they intended to help him but that their efforts actually did? Maybe there are other reasons that people who voted for Obama twice voted for Trump.
You look at the margin of victory in the key states and the impact of the stolen emails on the polls, along with the number of 'likes' that the Russian troll-bots garnered, and absolutely it had an impact. Of course it did.
1. If I recall, his margin of victory in those key states, if you break it down by district, was smaller than the margin of victory for Republican candidates in those districts.
2. The 'likes' by troll-bots is also hard to quantify because Facebook hasn't been forthcoming about the data. Fer instance, we don't know: how many of the likes were from other troll-bots, or how many of the likes were from undecided voters in those districts.
3. It's hard to quantify the impact of the stolen emails because the polls were so flawed.

Most importantly, you haven't accounted for the similarity between Trump's 'America First' economic populism and Obama's economic stimulus. As Biden pointed out, and he may have done before the election, her message was designed to appeal to progressives, not struggling working class voters.

This whole debate may be helping Republicans more than Democrats because it's keeping Dems from accepting they can't build a winning coalition around a progressive message.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by nafod » Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:21 am

Turdacious wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:45 am
nafod wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:01 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:34 pm
Is there any compelling evidence that the Russian interference helped Trump directly— not that they intended to help him but that their efforts actually did? Maybe there are other reasons that people who voted for Obama twice voted for Trump.
You look at the margin of victory in the key states and the impact of the stolen emails on the polls, along with the number of 'likes' that the Russian troll-bots garnered, and absolutely it had an impact. Of course it did.
1. If I recall, his margin of victory in those key states, if you break it down by district, was smaller than the margin of victory for Republican candidates in those districts.
2. The 'likes' by troll-bots is also hard to quantify because Facebook hasn't been forthcoming about the data. Fer instance, we don't know: how many of the likes were from other troll-bots, or how many of the likes were from undecided voters in those districts.
3. It's hard to quantify the impact of the stolen emails because the polls were so flawed.

Most importantly, you haven't accounted for the similarity between Trump's 'America First' economic populism and Obama's economic stimulus. As Biden pointed out, and he may have done before the election, her message was designed to appeal to progressives, not struggling working class voters.

This whole debate may be helping Republicans more than Democrats because it's keeping Dems from accepting they can't build a winning coalition around a progressive message.
All of your arguments are correct as to currents that swayed the voters, but some critical currents were supplied by Russia supporting Trump with stolen emails and with trollbots. When it is close, every bit matters, and it was close. No Russian interference/collusion with the Orange One, and its still a close election but with a different winner.
Don’t believe everything you think.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Fat Cat » Tue Aug 21, 2018 5:23 am

Thud wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:05 am
Fat Cat wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:20 am
Thud wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:50 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:33 pm
Thud wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:29 pm
Thud wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:05 pm
Fats, I'm not gonna get lost in the woods with you on parsing definitions, but separating kids from their parents without a plan or system to reunite them is as vile and malevolent as a society can get. We do more to reunite people with their coats and umbrellas. It's an indication of a very sick culture.
My intent is not to engage in sophistry but to point out some of the more breathless assertions you are making aren't completely grounded. Every American who gets convicted of a serious crime gets separated from their children and sent to prison. This is not some special treatment saved for the darker-hued out of racist hate. Now I absolutely think we should have a reformed, efficient, and flexible immigration system but in no way can a country allow people to simple come on in at will. That's not reasonable, and there's no country anywhere that thinks it is.
I think that you are unaware that children where separated from their parents, but the parents where sent home and their children are still here. And there is no mechanism to reunify them. In many cases it's not certain it's even possible at this point.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/new ... eral-judge

As for breathless, you're the 100% support guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTTzLbdaeTA
I am aware that there may be some children separated from their parents. I am aware it is the parents' fault. I am also totally unaware of any reason why those parents couldn't be reunited with their children in their country of origin.

I didn't understand the YouTube link.
No need to continue with this. Some people see something vile and call it beautiful. For other's it's still not heinous enough. I get where you land.

Fortunately saner minds prevailed and demanded he relent. Pity (though beautiful to some) the hundreds they haven't and/or can't reunite.

https://americasvoice.org/press_release ... e-orphans/
As the federal judge, the George W. Bush-appointed Dana Sabraw, said at the recent status conference:

All of this is the result of the government’s separation and then inability and failure to track and reunited. And the reality is that for every parent who is not located, there will be a permanently orphaned child and that is 100 percent the responsibility of the administration.

Today’s Washington Post editorial board lays out how the administration did not collect information that would be useful at this key moment:

A measure of the administration’s callous recklessness is that officials often failed to collect contact information for deported mothers and fathers — cellphone numbers, addresses — that could facilitate reunions with their children. In some cases, government forms list deportees’ addresses in Central America as “calle sin nombre” — street without a name. Very useful.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... -easy.html
So far that experience is not going well. Some parents in detention are struggling to find their children, some of whom are being flown to places as far away from the border as Michigan. Other parents have been deported without ever learning the whereabouts of their kids. As the Houston Chronicle reports, the records kept by the various agencies with a role in this process are messy and hard to track:

Social workers struggle to find parents within the two agencies overseeing immigrant adult detention, the departments of Justice and Homeland Security. Officials in charge of children have said they are not routinely provided information about how family separations occur or where a minor’s parents may be.
No need to be so spiteful. Surely we can find some common ground? As a starting point, I think we both agree that separating children from parents without any tracking or system in place to reunite them at some point is beyond crazy. Yes? Because it turns out that this program was Obama's.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/16/us/t ... icle-click

The Senate hearing came as the Trump administration was already under fire for mishandling the records of migrant families that were separated at the southwest border, which injected chaos and delays into a court-ordered effort to reunify them. It marked the end of a three-year investigation that began while President Barack Obama was still in office.

The process for handling children who travel to the United States alone — known as “unaccompanied minors” — has not changed significantly under President Trump.


No Fats. No common ground, because while I may oppose the law (and it was never applied as written until Trump's zero tolerance policy) you support it, heinously applied, 100%.

You're on your own there, pal.
If you say so. I admire your care for others.
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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Wild Bill » Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:08 am

nafod wrote:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:01 pm
... Russian troll-bots garnered
Why you think it is Russian bots?
On FB i saw IGXers who are hot supporters of Trump, who posted and reposted similar stuff wich you described as totally bullshit :) I am sure they are not russian spys.
I think it is the case of snobbery.
You think all those who are not agree with your political views are just fools who bought "bullshit" from russian bots.

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Re: Putin pinky-swears he didn't do it

Post by Fat Cat » Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:55 am

Wild Bill, you will always be my favorite Russian spybot.
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