Wu Flu

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Schlegel
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Schlegel » Fri May 01, 2020 4:06 am

Hospital where i work is losing 3 million a day.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by syaigh » Fri May 01, 2020 11:50 am

Thank you. I appreciate that. I periodically have quarantine rage. Grief does not help.

We are close to flattening the curve here. But now people want to protest without masks or social distancing. I am as sick of this quarantine as everyone else. I am afraid this will set us back. All because politics. And all these conspiracy theories are giving people justification to go out and ignore the safety precautions. Its infurating. I also want a haircut. But I also want to keep my dad safe.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by DrDonkeyLove... » Fri May 01, 2020 4:28 pm

syaigh wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 11:50 am
Thank you. I appreciate that. I periodically have quarantine rage. Grief does not help.

We are close to flattening the curve here. But now people want to protest without masks or social distancing. I am as sick of this quarantine as everyone else. I am afraid this will set us back. All because politics. And all these conspiracy theories are giving people justification to go out and ignore the safety precautions. Its infurating. I also want a haircut. But I also want to keep my dad safe.
I read about this a lot and have seen many contradictory things from people who should supposedly know what's going on but there is still lots of disagreement. My conclusion is that many experts think they know all kinds of stuff that they don't. My takeaways are that:

1) When our freedoms were limited the sell was that it was to be for a few weeks to flatten the curve so the medical establishment could get ready to handle the massive influx new COVID patients. That turned out to be false, the lock down has become semi-permanent to prevent future spikes.

2) Many more people have been infected than previously thought indicating that the death rate is far lower than originally thought.

3) Lockdown rules are arbitrary. I can buy socks at Walmart but Kohl's has to be closed. Crazy.

4) My ability to support my family is diminishing. I'm still afraid of the virus but I'm more afraid of poverty. I would go back to my previous life + a few extra cautions in a heartbeat. Better to face death facing forward than cowering.

My age has me in an official at risk category and I think that those with higher risk should get extra protections. We can put up with inconveniences for that. But the lock down has to be dialed way back. Everybody needs to get back to work to some degree. We can all debate what that degree is, but it's definitely more than what's allowed in my state of NY.

And, if we don't allow people to get back to work the protests from the desperate will get louder and perhaps more ugly than that.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by nafod » Fri May 01, 2020 6:04 pm

DrDonkeyLove... wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 4:28 pm
And, if we don't allow people to get back to work the protests from the desperate will get louder and perhaps more ugly than that.
I think this is the heart of it. A successful response looks just like an overreaction, so now a lot of places see overreaction, with the inevitable response to that.

We should get to progressively relaxing things. It’s going to drive up the infection rate, but that’s a balance we need to make.

The meatpacking plants make a nice case study for if we had done nothing, which is pretty much what they did. Minimal PPE, continued close quarters. The virus is running rampant, sickening lots and killing a few, and now our food supply chain is at risk. Need to ensure we don’t enable more of this with opening back up.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by syaigh » Fri May 01, 2020 7:44 pm

DrDonkeyLove... wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 4:28 pm
syaigh wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 11:50 am
Thank you. I appreciate that. I periodically have quarantine rage. Grief does not help.

We are close to flattening the curve here. But now people want to protest without masks or social distancing. I am as sick of this quarantine as everyone else. I am afraid this will set us back. All because politics. And all these conspiracy theories are giving people justification to go out and ignore the safety precautions. Its infurating. I also want a haircut. But I also want to keep my dad safe.
I read about this a lot and have seen many contradictory things from people who should supposedly know what's going on but there is still lots of disagreement. My conclusion is that many experts think they know all kinds of stuff that they don't. My takeaways are that:

1) When our freedoms were limited the sell was that it was to be for a few weeks to flatten the curve so the medical establishment could get ready to handle the massive influx new COVID patients. That turned out to be false, the lock down has become semi-permanent to prevent future spikes.

2) Many more people have been infected than previously thought indicating that the death rate is far lower than originally thought.

3) Lockdown rules are arbitrary. I can buy socks at Walmart but Kohl's has to be closed. Crazy.

4) My ability to support my family is diminishing. I'm still afraid of the virus but I'm more afraid of poverty. I would go back to my previous life + a few extra cautions in a heartbeat. Better to face death facing forward than cowering.

My age has me in an official at risk category and I think that those with higher risk should get extra protections. We can put up with inconveniences for that. But the lock down has to be dialed way back. Everybody needs to get back to work to some degree. We can all debate what that degree is, but it's definitely more than what's allowed in my state of NY.

And, if we don't allow people to get back to work the protests from the desperate will get louder and perhaps more ugly than that.
I don't disagree with you. I don't understand the inability to distance and wear masks. Well, I do. They think its a hoax, think its not dangerous. Because there is a lot of bullshit out there that they find credible.

In my mind, I think every city has the potential to become NY. The death rate seems to get much higher in areas that can't keep up with the critical care needs. And that's when this thing gets dangerous.

I think herd immunity will gradually increase, but we need to titrate exposure as much as possible. I see so many people saying things like "if you wear a mask its because you're afraid", etc. Well, I am to some degree, but wearing a mask protects more people from me than me from them. I'm more afraid that I may inadvertently kill someone else's mom. But people don't want to be told what to do and have been made afraid of taking precautions because they think that this is some nefarious plot to take their guns.

Like I said, there is a leadership vacuum here and its going to make a lot of people unnecessarily dead.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by syaigh » Fri May 01, 2020 7:59 pm

And yes, I think beaches, greenways, and parks should be open. I think a lot more businesses should be open, but I really need people to be responsible and take this seriously to feel comfortable with it.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by The Ginger Beard Man » Fri May 01, 2020 8:22 pm

I can’t imagine how hard it must be to stay at home if you live in a part of the country where the weather is nice and you didn’t get hit hard by the virus.
The weather in NYC will be beautiful for the next few days, and I can guarantee there will be no social distancing. We are probably facing another month before the lockdown order is lifted, and as bad as it was here it will be very difficult to enforce.
As far as masks, people here are good about it. You can’t enter any business without one. But people are also confused about it. I was yelled at the other day for not wearing one as I walked down the street, where it isn’t necessary. And recently thrown out of a laundromat for not wearing gloves. And the gloves are generally a terrible idea.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by The Ginger Beard Man » Fri May 01, 2020 8:27 pm

nafod wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:06 pm
I bet we are under-counting significantly. Comparison to historical records, which are consistent from year to year, will give us the data.

https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1255452784696143872

Image

Image
Those numbers on the far right may also be all the people who didn’t get treated for other illnesses. Nobody was going to hospitals, urgent care, or their primary doc for any reason.
Even the few that did, were often found to have Covid. There was an interesting op ed in the Times by a doc from New Hampshire who came down to help at Bellevue. A stabbing victim came in, they did a chest x ray to see if his lung had collapsed, and he had Covid. Car accident victim came in, Covid. They started giving everyone chest x rays and almost everyone had it.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by The Ginger Beard Man » Fri May 01, 2020 8:30 pm

Blaidd Drwg wrote:Disengage from the outcome and do work.
Jezzy Bell wrote:Use a fucking barbell, pansy.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by syaigh » Fri May 01, 2020 8:52 pm

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 8:22 pm
I can’t imagine how hard it must be to stay at home if you live in a part of the country where the weather is nice and you didn’t get hit hard by the virus.
The weather in NYC will be beautiful for the next few days, and I can guarantee there will be no social distancing. We are probably facing another month before the lockdown order is lifted, and as bad as it was here it will be very difficult to enforce.
As far as masks, people here are good about it. You can’t enter any business without one. But people are also confused about it. I was yelled at the other day for not wearing one as I walked down the street, where it isn’t necessary. And recently thrown out of a laundromat for not wearing gloves. And the gloves are generally a terrible idea.
Well honestly we are spoiled here. The greenways are open. Most people have houses and yards. The hardware stores are open. The landscaping in my neighborhood looks incredible because everyone is taking out their boredom on their lawns. Thats why i dont get people being frustrated about wearing a mask in a store.

I can imagine being in an apartment in a crowded city is far more frustrating.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Fri May 01, 2020 10:39 pm

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 8:27 pm
nafod wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:06 pm
I bet we are under-counting significantly. Comparison to historical records, which are consistent from year to year, will give us the data.

https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1255452784696143872

Image

Image
Those numbers on the far right may also be all the people who didn’t get treated for other illnesses. Nobody was going to hospitals, urgent care, or their primary doc for any reason.
Even the few that did, were often found to have Covid. There was an interesting op ed in the Times by a doc from New Hampshire who came down to help at Bellevue. A stabbing victim came in, they did a chest x ray to see if his lung had collapsed, and he had Covid. Car accident victim came in, Covid. They started giving everyone chest x rays and almost everyone had it.
I don't think you can diagnose COVID-19 from an x-ray, can you? You need to have specific test I thought.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Schlegel » Fri May 01, 2020 11:20 pm

The inflammation in the lungs makes the x-ray appear different. It's a normal quick diagnostic when checking for pneumonia.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by nafod » Fri May 01, 2020 11:28 pm

syaigh wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 8:52 pm
The Ginger Beard Man wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 8:22 pm
I can’t imagine how hard it must be to stay at home if you live in a part of the country where the weather is nice and you didn’t get hit hard by the virus.
The weather in NYC will be beautiful for the next few days, and I can guarantee there will be no social distancing. We are probably facing another month before the lockdown order is lifted, and as bad as it was here it will be very difficult to enforce.
As far as masks, people here are good about it. You can’t enter any business without one. But people are also confused about it. I was yelled at the other day for not wearing one as I walked down the street, where it isn’t necessary. And recently thrown out of a laundromat for not wearing gloves. And the gloves are generally a terrible idea.
Well honestly we are spoiled here. The greenways are open. Most people have houses and yards. The hardware stores are open. The landscaping in my neighborhood looks incredible because everyone is taking out their boredom on their lawns. Thats why i dont get people being frustrated about wearing a mask in a store.

I can imagine being in an apartment in a crowded city is far more frustrating.
I spend my free time out in the woods or on creeks as much as possible, and with the virus, all of the trail head parking lots are full with people getting outside. The funny thing is, with people trying to maintain separation, when you come up on someone on a trail they always give you a momentary look like they’ve just buried a body. Then everything’s cool as you each other the “we’re all in this together” look.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by The Ginger Beard Man » Fri May 01, 2020 11:55 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 10:39 pm
The Ginger Beard Man wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 8:27 pm
nafod wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:06 pm
I bet we are under-counting significantly. Comparison to historical records, which are consistent from year to year, will give us the data.

https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1255452784696143872

Image

Image
Those numbers on the far right may also be all the people who didn’t get treated for other illnesses. Nobody was going to hospitals, urgent care, or their primary doc for any reason.
Even the few that did, were often found to have Covid. There was an interesting op ed in the Times by a doc from New Hampshire who came down to help at Bellevue. A stabbing victim came in, they did a chest x ray to see if his lung had collapsed, and he had Covid. Car accident victim came in, Covid. They started giving everyone chest x rays and almost everyone had it.
I don't think you can diagnose COVID-19 from an x-ray, can you? You need to have specific test I thought.
What Schlegel said. Apparently, the lungs look like ground glass on an x ray.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Sat May 02, 2020 12:48 am

Schlegel wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 11:20 pm
The inflammation in the lungs makes the x-ray appear different. It's a normal quick diagnostic when checking for pneumonia.
Ya sure but without knowing whether the person has non-viral pneumonia, emphysema, pleural effusion, cystic fibrosis, lung cancer, or a host of other possible ailments simply saying, "ya, COVID" seems pretty unscientific.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by DrDonkeyLove... » Sat May 02, 2020 12:56 am

syaigh wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 7:59 pm
And yes, I think beaches, greenways, and parks should be open. I think a lot more businesses should be open, but I really need people to be responsible and take this seriously to feel comfortable with it.
I like my mask, I don't miss shaking hands, I've been ahead of the semi-obsessive hand cleaning thing for a few years, and I appreciate all the cleaning I see going on in the open stores. I hope we adopt some of the pandemic changes permanently.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Sat May 02, 2020 1:05 am

Michigan militiamen seem to be overcompensating.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Sat May 02, 2020 1:05 am

DrDonkeyLove... wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 12:56 am
syaigh wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 7:59 pm
And yes, I think beaches, greenways, and parks should be open. I think a lot more businesses should be open, but I really need people to be responsible and take this seriously to feel comfortable with it.
I like my mask, I don't miss shaking hands, I've been ahead of the semi-obsessive hand cleaning thing for a few years, and I appreciate all the cleaning I see going on in the open stores. I hope we adopt some of the pandemic changes permanently.
Autist detected.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Schlegel » Sat May 02, 2020 1:51 am

Fat Cat wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 12:48 am
Schlegel wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 11:20 pm
The inflammation in the lungs makes the x-ray appear different. It's a normal quick diagnostic when checking for pneumonia.
Ya sure but without knowing whether the person has non-viral pneumonia, emphysema, pleural effusion, cystic fibrosis, lung cancer, or a host of other possible ailments simply saying, "ya, COVID" seems pretty unscientific.
Yes. It's more of a " Lungs look clear, I guess you won't die on me." screening tool right now.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Protobuilder » Sat May 02, 2020 4:58 am

Schlegel wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 1:51 am
Fat Cat wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 12:48 am
Schlegel wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 11:20 pm
The inflammation in the lungs makes the x-ray appear different. It's a normal quick diagnostic when checking for pneumonia.
Ya sure but without knowing whether the person has non-viral pneumonia, emphysema, pleural effusion, cystic fibrosis, lung cancer, or a host of other possible ailments simply saying, "ya, COVID" seems pretty unscientific.
Yes. It's more of a " Lungs look clear, I guess you won't die on me." screening tool right now.
Chinese doctors were using x-rays for confirmation because a lot of their tests were inaccurate or took forever. Reports were that after they had seen hundreds of patients they knew what they were looking for but this was a better confirmation than the actual tests.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Mon May 04, 2020 5:24 pm

Protobuilder wrote:
Sat May 02, 2020 4:58 am
Chinese doctors
LMAO. What will you think of next?
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by The Ginger Beard Man » Tue May 05, 2020 1:57 pm

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/04/health/f ... index.html


Looks like it was already in France in late December.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Tue May 05, 2020 3:47 pm

SF just did some anti-body testing in The Mission and none of the whites in the sample (33%) tested positive but +90% of the mexicans did.

No one knows wtf is going on.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Tue May 05, 2020 8:12 pm

Uh oh bros.

On April 2, 2020 the University of Pittsburgh made the following announcement:

University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine scientists today announced a potential vaccine against SARS-CoV-2, the new coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic. When tested in mice, the vaccine, delivered through a fingertip-sized patch, produces antibodies specific to SARS-CoV-2 at quantities thought to be sufficient for neutralizing the virus.

https://www.upmc.com/media/news/040220- ... v2-vaccine

Then yesterday, May 4, 2020 the following:

Coronavirus In Pittsburgh: Researcher Killed In Apparent Murder-Suicide Was Close To ‘Making Very Significant Findings’ Related To COVID-19, Pitt Says

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/05 ... r-suicide/

Also this: Three Russian Doctors Treating The Coronavirus Have Fallen Out Of Windows In Just Over A Week

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ch ... oronavirus
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Tue May 05, 2020 9:53 pm

Was just going to post this.

Yeah... it's... welp...

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