Choke hold alternatives

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Turdacious
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Choke hold alternatives

Post by Turdacious » Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:13 pm

Seems like there’s a big movement to ban chokeholds by law-enforcement. Just curious, but what are the alternatives, especially dealing with somebody who is big, strong, and might be on something.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:13 pm

Choke holds are extremely safe and did not cause the death of St. Floyd of Fentanyl, patron saint of home invasion robberies. I've made this point before on this board, but submission holds DO NOT WORK against an enraged/intoxicated/mentally ill person. You have to shut down their CNS. Chokes are the best way to do that.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Kazuya Mishima » Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:00 pm

Agree with choke holds being the safest and most efficient means to bring enraged groids under control.

Beyond that, we must bring back physical standards for police officers. There was a day that they wouldn't look twice at you unless you were a strapping Irish orangutan with fetal alcohol syndrome. Big zulus who can chuck spears the length of a football field in their native environment are also a fine choice. They've taken away all of the kinetic options (billy clubs to the shin bone, slap jacks to the forehead, sap glove punches across that smart MOWF). So, what's left is mechanical manipulation. You've either got to go out and hire all the BJJ studs and collegiate wrestlers that you can find with criminal justice degrees, or just admit that you need big ass strapping lads with meat hooks and threatening countenances. When a cop gets out of the patrol car, the sun should disappear and the schwoogie just asks to put the cuffs on himself. Five foot nothing alpinoids with 35% body fat and black women who look like oompa loompas ain't gonna cut it anymore.

MAKE COPS GIGANTIC AGAIN

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:20 pm

Hire Samoans and Tongans. They could absolute not care any less about any racial bitching and will stuff that ass in a mailbox if you lip up. And God help you if you blaspheme.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Kazuya Mishima » Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:06 pm

Fat Cat wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:20 pm
Hire Samoans and Tongans. They could absolute not care any less about any racial bitching and will stuff that ass in a mailbox if you lip up. And God help you if you blaspheme.
I am approve.

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by SubClaw » Fri Jun 19, 2020 8:03 am

Turdacious wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:13 pm
Seems like there’s a big movement to ban chokeholds by law-enforcement. Just curious, but what are the alternatives, especially dealing with somebody who is big, strong, and might be on something.
Chokes are quick, (kinda) easy to apply and extremely safe.

If they finally ban chokes, police will be forced to use baton strikes (WAY less than optimal and quite harmful) or throws (which are very, very, very dangerous).
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by SubClaw » Fri Jun 19, 2020 8:05 am

Fat Cat wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:20 pm
And God help you if you blaspheme.
Da fuq!
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:25 pm

SubClaw wrote:
Fri Jun 19, 2020 8:05 am
Fat Cat wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 10:20 pm
And God help you if you blaspheme.
Da fuq!
Oh give it a try. They're very conservative and very Christian.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Sangoma » Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:56 pm

My thoughts about the police exactly. I think at least some proportion of cases where excessive force is used by police is caused by fear. I mean the police not being confident of being able to resist the perpetrator should he get back to his feet. Big strong guys seldom exceed necessary force in a fight, unless they do it intentionally.

Also agree in regards to chokes. People get choked out on the mat pretty regularly. After a few rounds of There is twenty seconds of "Oh, fuck!", while the guy is coming around. The worst they get is a headache. There are a lot of guys that are difficult to hurt, especially when drunk or confused. In my earlier years I had to subdue quite a few delirious patients. You need quite a few people to hold them down, and "clever" things, like twisting their arms, just doesn't work.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Hanglow Joe » Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:34 pm

Not enough billy clubs and fire hoses either. How hard is it not to mouth off at a cop?

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Shafpocalypse Now » Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:12 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:13 pm
Seems like there’s a big movement to ban chokeholds by law-enforcement. Just curious, but what are the alternatives, especially dealing with somebody who is big, strong, and might be on something.
Beating them unconscious with a baton.
Shooting them.

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:52 pm

Shafpocalypse Now wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:12 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:13 pm
Seems like there’s a big movement to ban chokeholds by law-enforcement. Just curious, but what are the alternatives, especially dealing with somebody who is big, strong, and might be on something.
Beating them unconscious with a baton.
Shooting them.
Exactly this. It's like everything has come full circle.

People have cops because while everybody realizes that its ripe for abuse, it's better than not having cops.

Cops use chokeholds because while everybody realizes that they can harm or even kill, its better than the alternative of just bashing someone's head in.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:44 pm

While police body cameras appear to have no impact, police departments that ban chokeholds kill fewer people than those that don't.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:45 pm

Not doubting you, but what's your source? I'm struggling with the methodology that would establish a causal relationship.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:57 pm

I was skeptical of this as well and thought a) body cams increase accountability and b) choke holds are fairly safe.

The Police Use of Force Project analyzed the largest 100 US police departments and found 8 metrics that move the needle. Body cams don't appear to have an effect, but banning choke holds does.

http://useofforceproject.org/#analysis
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:58 pm

Can you point me to where they have a statement about their methodology? Because the website is clearly not objective and the "planning team" is not, shall we say, comprised on criminologists or statisticians.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Sangoma » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:13 pm

The study seems to be one sided. Extrapolating from medical research when you study side effects and complications you have to also look at the effectiveness of treatment. The most effective way to reduce side effects from medication is to stop prescribing them. The best way to avoid traffic accidents is to ban cars from roads. The most efficient way to eliminate police violence is to forbid them to do their job. Is that what study established? Without the other stats we cannot say.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:22 pm

Well said, and the whole site is pure Marxist activism. It doesn't make Spells wrong, but you're going to have to produce actual data and methods to make your point.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Sangoma » Tue Jun 23, 2020 12:35 am

I don't even care about the left tilt of that study, but their methodology is too simplistic to draw any conclusions.

If choke holds are a problem the you need to produce appropriate stats: how many fatalities are caused by them. That would be the starting point. Also, introducing regulation of one kind causes domino like effect that extends to other aspects of service in largely unpredictable way.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Turdacious » Tue Jun 23, 2020 4:10 am

Sangoma wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 12:35 am
I don't even care about the left tilt of that study, but their methodology is too simplistic to draw any conclusions.

If choke holds are a problem the you need to produce appropriate stats: how many fatalities are caused by them. That would be the starting point. Also, introducing regulation of one kind causes domino like effect that extends to other aspects of service in largely unpredictable way.
That study doesn't even pass the social science sniff test, never mind a medical one. I don't think that even The Lancet would publish this research.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:54 am

Only thing I've seen that reduces fatalities via police is more police. A lot more. Vallejo CA reduced their police force post 2008 and the shootings went through the roof.

Police do bad shit. I'm not a cop guy. But let's be real. This is a purely aesthetic issue. Fatal shootings are not a major problem and their fairly distributed racially.

We should have a massive trillion dollar prison overhaul if we're going to go with the imprison all the troublemakers method. Which absolutely works but is dumb.

Oh yeah. And get women off the force. They're the worst. Just the worst in every way.

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:56 am

And bodycams are LOL. Every defense attorney moves to have the footage suppressed because the juries go APE when they see what the cops put up with.

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:59 am

I stopped following after seeing the vid, and how obviously he wasn't obstructing his airway, but is that still the talking point that the guy was strangled?

If anything, he looked like he was waiting for the guy to die from poison or something. Lowest effort most chill strangulation murder in history.

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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by SubClaw » Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:59 am

I can't recall a single riot, statue beheading or autonomous zone being created back then.

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Maybe it's time to use a thing or two from the modern social justice warrior playbook and respond in kind next time something happens.
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Re: Choke hold alternatives

Post by Bennyonesix1 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:32 pm

Dude. From Clinton on the primary domestic focus of Federal Law Enforcement had been keeping whites from chimping out. And the nightmare conditions in prisons are worse for whites on every level.

Frank Rizzo bombed the MOVE house. That's about the only over the top Fed move against a POC group. The list of large scale Federal operations against white orgs even if just coincidentally white is looooooooong.

EDIT

Rizzo wasn't a Fed. But he was a god among men.
Last edited by Bennyonesix1 on Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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