Wu Flu

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:26 pm

https://andylevin.house.gov/media/press ... -authority
Congressman Andy Levin (MI-09) today wrote a letter signed by 56 of his House colleagues urging President Trump to use his authority under the Defense Production Act of 1950 for the production of vital medical supplies to meet the extreme demand during the coronavirus pandemic.
No Republican co-sponsors. WTF.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Mar 16, 2020 5:44 pm

All hands are dirty when it comes to the offshoring of America's medical supplies. I hope this is a wake up call for everyone.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Luke » Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:34 pm

The expert who went on Rogan basically said hand sanitiser isn't much good, but they're letting people have it understanding there is a positive psychological component to people feeling like they have control. Also, warm weather isn't helpful supposedly.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by vern » Tue Mar 17, 2020 1:03 am

“Wherever the crowd goes, run the other direction. They’re always wrong.” Bukowski

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by nafod » Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:19 pm

Damn, Vern. I thought you would post a picture of you wearing a MAGA hat and licking a toilet bowl. That was a good link.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by vern » Tue Mar 17, 2020 6:38 pm

“Wherever the crowd goes, run the other direction. They’re always wrong.” Bukowski

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by vern » Tue Mar 17, 2020 6:38 pm

Double post
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Fri Mar 20, 2020 5:52 pm

Nicholas Christakis has some great threads on twitter on several aspects of COVID19 that are worth reading. This one on immunity is particularly good:
https://twitter.com/NAChristakis/status ... 5557865472
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:26 pm

Interesting and relatively hopeful news in that thread.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by JimZipCode » Mon Mar 23, 2020 2:36 am

Turdacious wrote:
Fri Mar 20, 2020 5:52 pm
Nicholas Christakis has some great threads on twitter on several aspects of COVID19 that are worth reading. This one on immunity is particularly good:
https://twitter.com/NAChristakis/status ... 5557865472
Thanks for that.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:27 am

Christakis has been crushing it. Really really solid and nothing click baity.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Luke » Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:19 am

Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:27 am
Christakis has been crushing it. Really really solid and nothing click baity.
I've been witnessing several doctors on Twitter - who I originally followed as completely sane human beings devoid of all politics - devolve into Trump-bashing doomsday sayers. Reminds me of otherwise highly competent soldiers mentally breaking during battle. It's been quite startling to see. Makes you appreciate the good ones.

Speaking of which, "Dr. Steve" from Opie & Anthony fame is a great rational mind in all this too (https://www.twitter.com/weirdmedicine)

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by newguy » Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:00 pm

Luke wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:19 am
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:27 am
Christakis has been crushing it. Really really solid and nothing click baity.
I've been witnessing several doctors on Twitter - who I originally followed as completely sane human beings devoid of all politics - devolve into Trump-bashing doomsday sayers. Reminds me of otherwise highly competent soldiers mentally breaking during battle. It's been quite startling to see. Makes you appreciate the good ones.

Speaking of which, "Dr. Steve" from Opie & Anthony fame is a great rational mind in all this too (https://www.twitter.com/weirdmedicine)
I'd say any doctor who is not bashing the trump regime at this moment is probably showing their political side.

Here in the states the handling of the corona virus by the white house and congress has been an amazing mix of incompetence, negligence, and down right criminal behavior.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm

We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Fat Cat » Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:41 pm

Great time for partisanship, Spells.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm

Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Grandpa's Spells » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:06 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix.
False. Obama set up a pandemic response unit Trump killed and Obama's team specifically warned Trump's team about the scenario we now face:
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/1 ... mic-132797

This has nothing to do with Obama. Trump has been president for three years.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by nafod » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:16 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
???

Not a single thing you listed has a thing to do with direct Pandemic response.
Don’t believe everything you think.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by newguy » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:31 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
Seriously...does Trump come into your bedroom at night and give you handjobs or something?

Nothing on the list you created would have prevented Trump, in January, saying "oh shit, we need to get our ass moving on this coming storm."

His messaging did not reflect the reality of the knowledge he had at his disposal.

Instead him and his circle jerk of fucktards just kept saying "no big deal" and "hoax" while privately selling off stock.

Get your head out of your ass on this one.

How different would things have been if in January we put our full resources into getting tests, getting ventilators, preparing for shut downs, etc.

That all falls on the white house and pretending it's Obama's fault is lunacy.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:35 pm

nafod wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:16 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
???

Not a single thing you listed has a thing to do with direct Pandemic response.
They all deal with the capacity to deal with a pandemic.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:37 pm

newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:31 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
Seriously...does Trump come into your bedroom at night and give you handjobs or something?

Nothing on the list you created would have prevented Trump, in January, saying "oh shit, we need to get our ass moving on this coming storm."

His messaging did not reflect the reality of the knowledge he had at his disposal.

Instead him and his circle jerk of fucktards just kept saying "no big deal" and "hoax" while privately selling off stock.

Get your head out of your ass on this one.

How different would things have been if in January we put our full resources into getting tests, getting ventilators, preparing for shut downs, etc.

That all falls on the white house and pretending it's Obama's fault is lunacy.
You really think Trump could have fixed long term structural problems in our health care system in two months, plus the train wreck that is HHS? Bless your heart.
Last edited by Turdacious on Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:42 pm

Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:06 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix.
False. Obama set up a pandemic response unit Trump killed and Obama's team specifically warned Trump's team about the scenario we now face:
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/1 ... mic-132797

This has nothing to do with Obama. Trump has been president for three years.
Even the Washington Post says you're wrong-- https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... liminated/
The Trump team was told it could face specific challenges, such as shortages of ventilators, anti-viral drugs and other medical essentials, and that having a coordinated, unified national response was “paramount” — warnings that seem eerily prescient given the ongoing coronavirus crisis.
Translation-- we've identified some problems we left you. Good luck fixing them. Deuces!
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by newguy » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:45 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:37 pm
newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:31 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
Seriously...does Trump come into your bedroom at night and give you handjobs or something?

Nothing on the list you created would have prevented Trump, in January, saying "oh shit, we need to get our ass moving on this coming storm."

His messaging did not reflect the reality of the knowledge he had at his disposal.

Instead him and his circle jerk of fucktards just kept saying "no big deal" and "hoax" while privately selling off stock.

Get your head out of your ass on this one.

How different would things have been if in January we put our full resources into getting tests, getting ventilators, preparing for shut downs, etc.

That all falls on the white house and pretending it's Obama's fault is lunacy.
You really think Trump could have fixed long term structural problems in our health care system in two months, plus the train wreck that is HHS? Bless your heart.
You really think Trump's messaging on this crisis has been accurate an on point? Fuck your ass.

You know that prick bungled this. I don't know what your stake is in denying it.

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Re: Wu Flu

Post by Turdacious » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:49 pm

newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:45 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:37 pm
newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:31 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
Seriously...does Trump come into your bedroom at night and give you handjobs or something?

Nothing on the list you created would have prevented Trump, in January, saying "oh shit, we need to get our ass moving on this coming storm."

His messaging did not reflect the reality of the knowledge he had at his disposal.

Instead him and his circle jerk of fucktards just kept saying "no big deal" and "hoax" while privately selling off stock.

Get your head out of your ass on this one.

How different would things have been if in January we put our full resources into getting tests, getting ventilators, preparing for shut downs, etc.

That all falls on the white house and pretending it's Obama's fault is lunacy.
You really think Trump could have fixed long term structural problems in our health care system in two months, plus the train wreck that is HHS? Bless your heart.
You really think Trump's messaging on this crisis has been accurate an on point? Fuck your ass.

You know that prick bungled this. I don't know what your stake is in denying it.
Nobody here's defending Trump's messaging on this. He inherited a mess and has made no real progress (and has shown no real interest) in fixing it. Denying that is just ignorant.
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newguy
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Re: Wu Flu

Post by newguy » Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:52 pm

Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:49 pm
newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:45 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:37 pm
newguy wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:31 pm
Turdacious wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:53 pm
Grandpa's Spells wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:47 pm
We have worse testing, but at the moment it appears our curve is worse than Italy's. Trump was still calling this a hoax a few weeks ago. Fox was laughing this off. Trump got briefings saying this was coming and did nothing. Obama's team warned his during the transition and they dumped the prep.

The incompetence is horrific and the GOP-controlled parts of the federal government are acting like they head a shithole country.
The Trump administration certainly deserves a lot of criticism, but the reality is that Obama dumped a mess in Trump's lap which Trump hasn't done much of anything to fix. Most of the mess is related to the failure of Obamacare to solve pre-existing problems it was designed to solve and which this crisis is exposing such as:

1. An inability to manage a slow developing crisis (opioid epidemic). If federal regulators couldn't and can't deal with a slow moving crisis, how do we expect them to deal with a fast moving one?
2. Poor fiscal condition of hospitals dealing with poorer and more rural populations. These are the hospitals that are really on the front lines of this crisis (they get more than their fair share of sicker patients). Obamacare, by decreasing the number of uninsured and by increasing Medicaid reimbursement, was supposed to reverse this problem. It didn't. These hospitals still lack staff, and aren't in a position to compete with hospitals in wealthier areas for augmentation.
3. States underfund Medicaid. Obamacare tried to get states to increase their Medicaid reimbursement rates, and overwhelmingly they didn't. It's easy to blame Republicans for this (with their emphasis on cutting taxes and willingness to allow states to make it harder to get/stay on Medicaid), but the bigger factor is that Medicaid doesn't compete well with other public priorities (especially public pension bombs, teachers pushing for long delayed cost of living raises, backlash against states and municipalities solving fiscal problems by forcing law enforcement to fund themselves through ticket and civil forfeiture revenue, etc...).
4. High health care administration costs and administrative inefficiency. We were among the worst in the developed world and got worse under Obamacare. High costs aren't necessarily a problem, but under Obamacare we didn't get more efficiency or effectiveness out of it.
5. Abuse of medical billing and coding. This was a problem before Obamacare that is now much worse.
6. Poor health of poor people due to poorly managed lifestyle related factors (like obesity and pre-diabetes). Obamacare was supposed to fix this, but their health got worse.
Seriously...does Trump come into your bedroom at night and give you handjobs or something?

Nothing on the list you created would have prevented Trump, in January, saying "oh shit, we need to get our ass moving on this coming storm."

His messaging did not reflect the reality of the knowledge he had at his disposal.

Instead him and his circle jerk of fucktards just kept saying "no big deal" and "hoax" while privately selling off stock.

Get your head out of your ass on this one.

How different would things have been if in January we put our full resources into getting tests, getting ventilators, preparing for shut downs, etc.

That all falls on the white house and pretending it's Obama's fault is lunacy.
You really think Trump could have fixed long term structural problems in our health care system in two months, plus the train wreck that is HHS? Bless your heart.
You really think Trump's messaging on this crisis has been accurate an on point? Fuck your ass.

You know that prick bungled this. I don't know what your stake is in denying it.
Nobody here's defending Trump's messaging on this. He inherited a mess and has made no real progress (and has shown no real interest) in fixing it. Denying that is just ignorant.
But inheriting a mess has nothing to do with managing this crisis properly from the beginning and properly managing it would not have prevented it, but would have left us in a much better state than we are now.

Maybe the mess prevented an optimal response, but that doesn't excuse this absolute criminal shit show that our country has been doing.

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