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Forums › Free Speech › Al-fatwā: Global Jihad Against the Fat
https://www.reuters.com/technology/pinterest-bans-all-weight-loss-ads-2021-07-01/
July 1 (Reuters) – Pinterest (PINS.N) is banning all ads with weight loss language and imagery, including ads that idealize or denigrate certain body types, it said on Thursday.
The digital pinboard site said it would also not allow ads with testimonials about weight loss or weight loss products, or ads referencing Body Mass Index (BMI) or similar indexes.
“This stance makes Pinterest the only major platform to prohibit all weight loss ads. It’s an expansion of our ad policies that have long prohibited body shaming and dangerous weight loss products or claims,” the company said in a blog post on Thursday.
Ads promoting healthy lifestyles, habits or fitness services and products are still allowed on the platform if they do not “focus on weight loss.” The company said it had developed the policy with guidance from the National Eating Disorders Association.
Pinterest’s head of policy, Sarah Bromma, said in an interview that the rule change prioritized Pinterest users’ “emotional and mental health and wellbeing, especially those directly impacted by eating disorders or diet culture or body shaming.”
Pinterest, which has long grappled with combating pro-eating disorder content on its site and has since 2015 blocked such searches and directed users to expert organizations, already has rules against ads promoting weight loss pills or containing before-and-after weight-loss imagery.
The company also said this week that its global head of inclusion and diversity, Tyi McCray, was leaving the company after less than a year. The move was first reported by Protocol.
Pinterest, which went public in 2019, has faced controversies around diversity and inequality in the last year, including when two former policy team employees alleged racial discrimination in the workplace.
Reporting by Elizabeth Culliford in New York; Editing by Steve Orlofsky
This type of calculated aggression against the domains of beauty, health, and good taste will not stand unopposed by your humble servant. From now on, it’s open season on Fats in this thread. Let the fat people hate flow freely. God wills it.
I wonder what it will take for the country’s obesity rates to decrease?
Junk food and sitting around on tech are both highly addictive, and human decision-making, in general, is proving inadequate to the challenge.
And the stigma attached to obesity may help motivate some, but for others it’s paralyzing. I know someone who’s so embarrassed about their appearance they won’t even walk outside for exercise for perceived fear of judgement.
I wonder what it will take for the country’s obesity rates to decrease? Junk food and sitting around on tech are both highly addictive, and human decision-making, in general, is proving inadequate to the challenge. And the stigma attached to obesity may help motivate some, but for others it’s paralyzing. I know someone who’s so embarrassed about their appearance they won’t even walk outside for exercise for perceived fear of judgement.
Surely refusing to acknowledge the problem or its profound effects on health and quality of life will help! More and more, whether its social media, gaming, pornography, or the “food” industry, the model for corporate capitalism is addiction, not brand loyalty based on product quality and utility. There’s no better consumer than an addict.
I wonder what it will take for the country’s obesity rates to decrease? Junk food and sitting around on tech are both highly addictive, and human decision-making, in general, is proving inadequate to the challenge. And the stigma attached to obesity may help motivate some, but for others it’s paralyzing. I know someone who’s so embarrassed about their appearance they won’t even walk outside for exercise for perceived fear of judgement.
Surely refusing to acknowledge the problem or its profound effects on health and quality of life will help! More and more, whether its social media, gaming, pornography, or the “food” industry, the model for corporate capitalism is addiction, not brand loyalty based on product quality and utility. There’s no better consumer than an addict.
lol, good to have you back 🙂
Being an ostrich about it won’t help, but neither has telling people they’re fat succeeded either.
As a trainer, I started emphasizing that working out expands your opportunity to enjoy life more fully: for example, developing strong legs means hiking is no longer daunting…it could even be fun! Sharing this attitude seems to click with people and motivate them to work hard.
I’d love to be able to translate that approach of “we’re doing this because life is going to be way better!” into helping people change their eating habits. A narrative is more powerful than facts or labels.
Being an ostrich about it won’t help, but neither has telling people they’re fat succeeded either.
I wouldn’t be so sure of that. There was a time when society openly shamed and mocked the obese as the freaks they are, or were, until it became the norm. As that mentality of open hostility has waned, so has the levels of obesity in our society waxed. Humans are social and shame is a powerful motive…why not wield it? I appreciate that as a professional in the field, you have to cut a different line than I do, but my goal here is to build social hatred for fat people, not find solutions. The solution (eat less) is already obvious and needs no further elaboration.
Also: I can’t stand it. It’s ugly. And as much as I’m a NO FAT CHICKS kinda guy, it’s actually worse to see obese men shuffling around, mummified in lard.
Shame does work sometimes, whether intrinsically or extrinsically. If I didn’t feel ashamed of how shitty I was at sports, I never would have started working out.
OTOH, I have someone close whose gone from overweight to obese in the past few years. They eat a very rich diet, with huge portions, but there’s a cognitive disconnect because they choose mostly organic, whole foods. “I eat healthy!” they say after drenching their broccoli in grass-fed butter and olive oil.
This is a person with a history of mental health struggles, who’s hyper-sensitive, so I don’t think shame’s gonna be the solution if I want to keep a happy relationship with them. But ignoring it has been associated with them packing on the pounds. Will consider a different approach….
Shame does work sometimes, whether intrinsically or extrinsically. If I didn’t feel ashamed of how shitty I was at sports, I never would have started working out. OTOH, I have someone close whose gone from overweight to obese in the past few years. They eat a very rich diet, with huge portions, but there’s a cognitive disconnect because they choose mostly organic, whole foods. “I eat healthy!” they say after drenching their broccoli in grass-fed butter and olive oil. This is a person with a history of mental health struggles, who’s hyper-sensitive, so I don’t think shame’s gonna be the solution if I want to keep a happy relationship with them. But ignoring it has been associated with them packing on the pounds. Will consider a different approach….
I have no idea what would help the butter vortex you are talking about, and I don’t verbally abuse every fat person I see, but it’s blatantly obvious that NOT shaming this person hasn’t worked. That said, it’s not your job to fix their life.
However, in other contexts, when people say things that are so cognitively dissonant that they make my head spin, I start asking targeted but superficially innocent questions: “Oh, I see. You do eat healthy foods. So, what do you think the problem is?” Sometimes playing a bit dumb gets people to lower their defenses enough to really stick the knife in deep.
99% percent of what people say with regard to eating and drinking it defensive nonsense that even they know is just cope, but sometimes when they have to articulate it to another person it just sounds so stupidly dishonest that they have to confront their own absurd lies. I had to confront my own dishonesty recently with regard to drinking alcohol, it wasn’t comfortable, but then again neither is lying to ourselves to obfuscate the truths we already know.
Being an ostrich about it won’t help, but neither has telling people they’re fat succeeded either.
I wouldn’t be so sure of that. There was a time when society openly shamed and mocked the obese as the freaks they are, or were, until it became the norm. As that mentality of open hostility has waned, so has the levels of obesity in our society waxed. Humans are social and shame is a powerful motive…why not wield it? I appreciate that as a professional in the field, you have to cut a different line than I do, but my goal here is to build social hatred for fat people, not find solutions. The solution (eat less) is already obvious and needs no further elaboration. Also: I can’t stand it. It’s ugly. And as much as I’m a NO FAT CHICKS kinda guy, it’s actually worse to see obese men shuffling around, mummified in lard.
This.
However, in other contexts, when people say things that are so cognitively dissonant that they make my head spin, I start asking targeted but superficially innocent questions: “Oh, I see. You do eat healthy foods. So, what do you think the problem is?”
This sounds like a reasonable approach, and I need to remember to use targeted questions in general when encountering cognitive dissonance…this person’s response when questioning their eating habits (and plenty of others I’ve encountered) is to instead blame their exercise levels. And then they blame their insufficient exercise levels on a myriad of things.
But I’ve also heard “bad genetics” (from a girl drinking a massive sugary frozen coffee), “life’s short” (from many people), “I deserve this xyz food.”
In any event, I’m gonna work on a narrative that gets people excited to eat good food in the right amounts for them.
As an aside, the rise of intermittent fasting has become a new hurdle to overcome. I have a client who’s ~30 pounds overweight, who recently became a vegan intermittent faster (which combined packed on 10 of those pounds). He does something like 4 spoon fulls of nut butter in his smoothie…but there’s this delusion that since it’s vegan and during a window, portion sizes are irrelevant.
Frustrating.
Preach it Brother Fats! I could stand to lose a few pounds (a few, not a few hundred…) and I shall. I’d be embarrassed to have my shirt off in public, in spite of the fact that compared to a seeming majority of the public, who are hanging out from the bottom of their shirts, I look damn good. I strongly favor a Romantic view – our icons, archetypes, and models should represent the pinnacle of achievement, and that includes physical achievement. I am thoroughly repulsed going in to Target, or a number of other stores, which have decided that in their advertising prodigious cellulite should be displayed as “beauty”. Rubbish! Nothing could be farther from the truth and all but a few deviants agree – silently or vocally.
I blame the self-esteem movement, the corruption of Nathaniel Brandon’s theories (not that he had it right, either…) for the idea that everyone should receive accolades, no matter how far they have fallen from the ideal. I sedulously disagree. All of human achievement revolves around aspiration and pursuit of excellence. Redefining excellence to mean “whatever the hell you happen to default to” does nothing for anyone, except the natural sloth. But it’s all a fraud, and we all know it. No one aspires to being 20, 50, 200 pounds over weight. No one aspires to running a 12 minute mile. No one aspires to being able to deadlift 135#. Some people may look forward to those benchmarks, if they’re on the lesser side of them, but no one aspires to those as ultimate goals.
I think it’s important to have great models, and inspirational to see great human achievement. You’re not a failure for not reaching those levels, but you *can* measure your success by how close you come. I cheer every overweight person I see running, biking, or walking, and scorn every one I see stuffing a full slice of pizza into their mouth without chewing, or ordering a triple-caramel, extra-whip, Caramel machiado.
We have greatly reduced the prevalence of smoking in the U.S. by virtue of “Social Norming” – which is to say, we made it less socially acceptable than it once was. Hot on the heals of this success we are using “Social Norming” to increase morbid obesity. Welcome to Biden’s America.
-Stick
Well, this thread inspired me to send an e-mail to all my clients (and another 50 or so people on my mailing list).
I’m curious how it will be received, and could have been more tactful, but the basis was:
I believe the most important part of healthy eating is total caloric intake: the less the healthier. This has been demonstrated in multiple studies very convincingly. The other part, quality, is less well defined and/or proven. In fact, it is easy to make an argument that most diets considered healthy – Mediterranean, Okinawan, Sonoma and what not – derive their benefits through reduced caloric intake. In any case, this is a good topic to argue about, but not really the point here.
The point is that manufactured modern foods are addictive and calorie dense. Sure, there are occasional adverts for broccoli, apples or plain rice, but most of the time it’s for the stuff that you will want to have more of even when you are full. Very few of us will look forward to a dinner of boiled potatoes and cabbage, but add some butter, salt and sugar to it, along with some spices, and you have the potential of overeating on a food that has three times more energy.
The duplicity of the Pinterest lies in the fact that they are ok with advertising foods that are calorie dense, but not ok with advertisements of the cure for its consequences. This is double speak at its best.
I’m not kidding about feminism being responsible, by the way.
I think you can make a case that most of the societal ills we see have their roots in the damage feminism, at the least since the “second wave”, has done to the minds of Western boys and girls who grow up to be fat, maladjusted, frustrated, depressed and angry adults.
I’m not kidding about feminism being responsible, by the way.
I think you can make a case that most of the societal ills we see have their roots in the damage feminism, at the least since the “second wave”, has done to the minds of Western boys and girls who grow up to be fat, maladjusted, frustrated, depressed and angry adults.
Original feminisim was “kindly remove your boot off my neck so I can choose how I want to live my life”. I don’t know what you define as second wave feminism, but I will say this, original feminism was never meant to grant women the “right to have it all”. My mother was a staunch feminist her entire life and was always baffled by the women who felt they had a right to do everything all at once and felt they fucked things up amazingly when they did. She said, “we just wanted to have the choice”. I would say second wave feminism is a perversion of feminsim when it merged with the self-esteem movement. And the self-esteem movement perverted pretty much everything it touched.
Anyway, my point is that I wouldn’t blame feminism so much as these later generations thinking they have a right to be however they want to be if it “makes them happy”. And that’s fine I guess, but it all ends up having a negative impact on everyone else at some point. I have a morbidly obese sister who I will end up having to care for if I don’t die before she does. We have a few morbidly obese and unhealthy older adults in the familly who will very quickly become someone’s problem. But, I could say the same of the smokers/drinkers/assholes/people who aren’t financially responsible . . . . whatever you name it. People being inherently selfish because “its their right” is probably the biggest problem we face as country because someone eventually has to clean up their messes. And its not going to be them. And they are going to demand it as “their right”.
(Yes, I am a liberal and I think some people genuinely need a helping hand to get on their feet, but a lot of people these days have cut off their own feet out of spite.)
I’m not kidding about feminism being responsible, by the way. I think you can make a case that most of the societal ills we see have their roots in the damage feminism, at the least since the “second wave”, has done to the minds of Western boys and girls who grow up to be fat, maladjusted, frustrated, depressed and angry adults.
Original feminisim was “kindly remove your boot off my neck so I can choose how I want to live my life”. I don’t know what you define as second wave feminism, but I will say this, original feminism was never meant to grant women the “right to have it all”. My mother was a staunch feminist her entire life and was always baffled by the women who felt they had a right to do everything all at once and felt they fucked things up amazingly when they did. She said, “we just wanted to have the choice”. I would say second wave feminism is a perversion of feminsim when it merged with the self-esteem movement. And the self-esteem movement perverted pretty much everything it touched. Anyway, my point is that I wouldn’t blame feminism so much as these later generations thinking they have a right to be however they want to be if it “makes them happy”. And that’s fine I guess, but it all ends up having a negative impact on everyone else at some point. I have a morbidly obese sister who I will end up having to care for if I don’t die before she does. We have a few morbidly obese and unhealthy older adults in the familly who will very quickly become someone’s problem. But, I could say the same of the smokers/drinkers/assholes/people who aren’t financially responsible . . . . whatever you name it. People being inherently selfish because “its their right” is probably the biggest problem we face as country because someone eventually has to clean up their messes. And its not going to be them. And they are going to demand it as “their right”. (Yes, I am a liberal and I think some people genuinely need a helping hand to get on their feet, but a lot of people these days have cut off their own feet out of spite.)
I’m hardly an expert but in general:
First wave feminism was the women’s suffrage movement that resulted in the 19th Amendment, ca. 1900-1920.
Second wave feminism is the 1960s through 1980-ish, which saw the rise of birth control and ended around the time the Equal Rights Amendment failed. These are your pant-suit ladies.
Third wave feminism is your 1990s, very early 2000s Riot Grrrl era, and central issues abortion rights, violence against women, and sexual liberation. These are your “porn empowers women” types lol.
Fourth wave feminism is what we have today with the emphasis on intersectionality.
As is clear from this brief summary, it’s a progressive disease resulting in madness and death. I don’t know that I blame global obesity on feminism, but it is at least in part guilty for the body positivity nonsense we see today, which is a convenient defense for fat bitches who would like to cast justifiable criticism of the ugliness and unhealthiness of obesity as misogynist.
I’d say the body positivity is coming second, the fat is coming first. Like a tsunami of lard. It’s due to how we live and what we eat.
Body positivity is just trying to justify it after the fact, but the fat is here to stay. Or until the apocalypse, when everyone gets skinny.
I’d say the body positivity is coming second, the fat is coming first. Like a tsunami of lard. It’s due to how we live and what we eat. Body positivity is just trying to justify it after the fact, but the fat is here to stay. Or until the apocalypse, when everyone gets skinny.
I don’t really disagree, but ever since the 70s there has been an emphasis on the “everyone’s special” and “you can be anything you want” dynamic and I see body positivity as a lineal descendant of that, where everyone deserves affirmation no matter how big a loser they are. With that Zeitgeist, people have gotten fatter and fatter without the pall of shame that would have hung over them in times past.
Have a brand-new personal training client who wants to drop 30+ pounds (after gaining all this weight he can no longer surf well).
Thought of this thread and wrote him a strict nutrition plan (e.g. 8 egg whites, 1 tablespoon of olive oil, 1/2 cup oatmeal, 1/2 an apple is breakfast).
The plan should work provided he follows it, but we’ll see.
Have a brand-new personal training client who wants to drop 30+ pounds (after gaining all this weight he can no longer surf well). Thought of this thread and wrote him a strict nutrition plan (e.g. 8 egg whites, 1 tablespoon of olive oil, 1/2 cup oatmeal, 1/2 an apple is breakfast). The plan should work provided he follows it, but we’ll see.
Picking on myself, by way of example, it is astonishing to me how many times in my life I have known what the “right” thing to do is, but haven’t done it.
Picking on myself, by way of example, it is astonishing to me how many times in my life I have known what the “right” thing to do is, but haven’t done it.
I think most people know, at least at a gut level, why they want to (lose weight / gain muscle / manage finances / eat healthy / stop smoking) – they just can’t get results soon enough. Much of our society is structured around instant gratification. The self-help books might say “he wants a cigarette more than he wants to be healthy” – but that’s an oversimplification. If you’re going to simplify, the truth is you can feel better (momentarily) *now* by continuing your bad habit, or you can make yourself uncomfortable now with the promise that _eventually_ you’ll feel better down the road. What’s even worse is that “feeling better” happens so gradually, a lot of people don’t even notice it. They never have that day when they wake up and think “I feel 1000% better now that I’m —“. In fact, they start to think “I don’t really feel any different”. The exception are the ‘rock-bottom’ people. Their days are so riddled with misery that they can actually notice the change in short order.
So the question is: How do you change behavior (yours or that of another) before ‘rock bottom’? And the answer, though not very popular, is *willpower*. For all the lies told in the ‘self help’ section of the local bookstore, it takes willpower to endure the discomfort of denying yourself today in order to achieve a better tomorrow. We all fail at this some of the time. (Maybe even Bram…) However, the successful are those who keep trying and who exercise will more often than not. There are some “hacks” to help – my favorite is “micro habits” (look it up), but I decry any of the self-help bullshit that says anything to the tune of “works without willpower!”.
So, sorry Mr. & Mrs America (and elsewhere), you’ve been lied to. If you want something, you need to work for it. No pill, nor potion, nor surgery is going to make you into the person you want to be. Work on developing your will (and expending it wisely) and you will be eons ahead.
-brief pause – this is longer than I thought… –
So, what do I mean by that? Two steps: develop willpower & spend it wisely. Let’s start with the latter. There have been buckets of studies showing that willpower (like strength, focus, or most any human attribute, is a limited resource and that as we exercise it, it fatigues and we have less to give. Therefore it is paramount that you avoid situations that will test your willpower more than must be done. The least-successful dieter I know (a relative) is a master at sabotaging her goals before she’s even begun. I recall at one time when she started a diet she put a ‘king size’ snickers on her counter to “show she could resist it”. I suspect it was replaced a few times before, probably a week later, she gave up on her diet. Similarly, if you’re trying to quit drinking, it’s probably STUPID to head to the bar with your buddies pretending you’re just going to have water, be the DD, whatever… You’ll need will – make it as easy on yourself as you can – because it won’t be easy…
Second is developing willpower – that’s the tricky one! “Micro habits” is a great strategy for developing a positive habit – just do at least one pullup, pushup, bench press, add at least $1 to your savings, etc. It’s easy to do, and chance are you’ll do more – and you certainly will as benefits accumulate. But, it’s not that great at ceasing bad behavior. Distraction, however, is. If you can muster enough will to say “I will do <something healthy and moderately challenging (exercise)> every time I want <destructive behavior>, then contemplate my positive progress for 30 minutes before engaging in <destructive behavior>” you can slow down and eventually eliminate the destructive behavior. This is the most successful approach I’ve found – BUT (you knew that was coming, right?) it can backfire on someone who is already exerting their will… Take a smoker, or alcoholic, or surfer, that has successfully avoided their vice for a while and when they stumble across a “plan” that says “don’t forbid <whatever> outright” that becomes an excuse for relapse… Which is another way of saying that there is no one-size fits-all solution.
If you’re trying to change your own behavior, and succeeding, keep it up! If you’re trying to change you behavior and failing try ‘micro-habits’ and distraction… If you’re trying to change another’s behavior you should probably ignore me, because my track record with that is dismal…, but it still makes sense to me to support the positive and at least don’t endorse the negative.
-stick
Picking on myself, by way of example, it is astonishing to me how many times in my life I have known what the “right” thing to do is, but haven’t done it.I think this guy will do the right thing, because his motivation is coming from the right place.We all need the fuel to get through the obstacles and excuses.I spent time with a family member today who wants to lose a lot of weight, and I couldn’t figure out her “why.” The most I could get was that she wanted to feel a little better moving around. But that wasn’t motivating (I asked if she wanted to go for a short walk and she declined).I want to surf well, and date hot chicks, and not have any joint problems, and beat the fuck out of someone if necessary. And I take it as a personal responsibility to role-model good behaviors — for my family, and clients, and, to a lesser degree, other people as well.Those are my “whys” that help me eat a certain way, workout, and turn down alcohol.
I thought of this Bible verse the other day in respect to this thread:
“For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.” -Romans 7:19
How often in our lives is this the case? I hear you about a sense of personal responsibility to others as being a solid motivator. One of the big drivers in giving up booze, for me, was wanting to set a better example for my son. He’s a teenager now and I don’t want my behavior to set a poor example for him, so out with the bottles. That and personal vanity are my main motivators.
I think most people know, at least at a gut level, why they want to (lose weight / gain muscle / manage finances / eat healthy / stop smoking) – they just can’t get results soon enough. Much of our society is structured around instant gratification. The self-help books might say “he wants a cigarette more than he wants to be healthy” – but that’s an oversimplification. If you’re going to simplify, the truth is you can feel better (momentarily) *now* by continuing your bad habit, or you can make yourself uncomfortable now with the promise that _eventually_ you’ll feel better down the road. What’s even worse is that “feeling better” happens so gradually, a lot of people don’t even notice it. They never have that day when they wake up and think “I feel 1000% better now that I’m —“. In fact, they start to think “I don’t really feel any different”. The exception are the ‘rock-bottom’ people. Their days are so riddled with misery that they can actually notice the change in short order. So the question is: How do you change behavior (yours or that of another) before ‘rock bottom’? And the answer, though not very popular, is *willpower*. For all the lies told in the ‘self help’ section of the local bookstore, it takes willpower to endure the discomfort of denying yourself today in order to achieve a better tomorrow. We all fail at this some of the time. (Maybe even Bram…) However, the successful are those who keep trying and who exercise will more often than not. There are some “hacks” to help – my favorite is “micro habits” (look it up), but I decry any of the self-help bullshit that says anything to the tune of “works without willpower!”. So, sorry Mr. & Mrs America (and elsewhere), you’ve been lied to. If you want something, you need to work for it. No pill, nor potion, nor surgery is going to make you into the person you want to be. Work on developing your will (and expending it wisely) and you will be eons ahead. -brief pause – this is longer than I thought… – So, what do I mean by that? Two steps: develop willpower & spend it wisely. Let’s start with the latter. There have been buckets of studies showing that willpower (like strength, focus, or most any human attribute, is a limited resource and that as we exercise it, it fatigues and we have less to give. Therefore it is paramount that you avoid situations that will test your willpower more than must be done. The least-successful dieter I know (a relative) is a master at sabotaging her goals before she’s even begun. I recall at one time when she started a diet she put a ‘king size’ snickers on her counter to “show she could resist it”. I suspect it was replaced a few times before, probably a week later, she gave up on her diet. Similarly, if you’re trying to quit drinking, it’s probably STUPID to head to the bar with your buddies pretending you’re just going to have water, be the DD, whatever… You’ll need will – make it as easy on yourself as you can – because it won’t be easy… Second is developing willpower – that’s the tricky one! “Micro habits” is a great strategy for developing a positive habit – just do at least one pullup, pushup, bench press, add at least $1 to your savings, etc. It’s easy to do, and chance are you’ll do more – and you certainly will as benefits accumulate. But, it’s not that great at ceasing bad behavior. Distraction, however, is. If you can muster enough will to say “I will do <something healthy and moderately challenging (exercise)> every time I want <destructive behavior>, then contemplate my positive progress for 30 minutes before engaging in <destructive behavior>” you can slow down and eventually eliminate the destructive behavior. This is the most successful approach I’ve found – BUT (you knew that was coming, right?) it can backfire on someone who is already exerting their will… Take a smoker, or alcoholic, or surfer, that has successfully avoided their vice for a while and when they stumble across a “plan” that says “don’t forbid <whatever> outright” that becomes an excuse for relapse… Which is another way of saying that there is no one-size fits-all solution. If you’re trying to change your own behavior, and succeeding, keep it up! If you’re trying to change you behavior and failing try ‘micro-habits’ and distraction… If you’re trying to change another’s behavior you should probably ignore me, because my track record with that is dismal…, but it still makes sense to me to support the positive and at least don’t endorse the negative. -stick
First of all, good post. Intelligent purport and well articulated.
One thing that I would suggest to you is that not all things are simply a matter of a coarse application of willpower. There is a “skill” to using willpower wisely and judiciously, because as you note, it’s a finite resource…albeit one that can be strengthened and increased over time. You kind of allude to it when you mentioned addicts who hit rock bottom as an exception, so here’s my view.
First, being able to change is like a superpower. Most humans can’t. If you become one of the humans that can, you become something almost superhuman in the eyes of others. Whether it’s the people who can change their bodies, or their behavior, or the world around them, the people who know how to effect change are, and are seen as, powerful beings. Want to be one? It’s all in the power of the mind and our cognitive processes.
Second, if you want to change your behavior, first you need to examine your assumptions about WHY you do X when you want to do Y. Most people only SAY they want to do Y, but they really want to do X, and it’s revealed in their behavior. They are expressing an insincere thought. Perhaps they feel that they ought to do Y, but they really are getting something out of X and just paying lip service to Y for social currency.
But if you really want to Y, and find yourself continually doing X, the thing you must do is examine your assumptions. What do I get out of it that I keep coming back to this behavior? Why am I in this trap? Think of all the benefits you THINK you’re getting from this habit, examining each one individually and from both a positive and negative aspect. In other words, if overeating is your thing, examine the positives and the negatives. Usually, the negatives will vastly outweigh the so-called positives, and most of the positives aren’t as great as we build them up to be in our mind. A quick delight to the tongue vs. obesity, unsightliness, poor health, poor mobility, low sexual value, disease, diabetes, amputation, blindness, and early death. Gee, which way is the scale tipping?
When you’ve analyzed the positives and negatives of X, and you see how you’re stuck in this cycle, even though by your own analysis you’re caught in a trap that doesn’t offer many, if any benefits, the third thing that will happen is your outlook will begin to change. What once was attractive, no longer has that same luster. All you are is an addict caught in a trap. Even the things about it that once made it attractive, having examined each closely, aren’t that great. And you can harness the power of emotion here, you begin to hate the trap. You see it for what it is, a malicious snare and nothing more. Not a comfort. Not a pleasure. A trap.
When you begin to hate X and see Y as the only way out of the trap, then lasting change can happen. It’s not through the massive and continuous application of willpower, either. It’s through a permanent change in cognition, something like waking up. You’re no longer dreaming now. It’s like a person in a burning building or drowning in the ocean. Suddenly you see that the ONLY way out of the trap is to escape the hateful X and head for Y. And you will. Is it hard at first? Sure, but not nearly as hard as burning to death or drowning. Nobody needs encouragement, or even willpower, to escape a burning flame. It does take a momentary action, but then you’re safe from X forever. And just like a man who has escaped a burning building or drowning in the ocean, there’s no desire to go back to them. After all, why would you? You see them for what they are now, hateful things and dangerous.
I say all this only because while I agree with much of what you say, just relying on willpower is like relying on a very finite resource. Using willpower skillfully, to change our way of thinking, so that we don’t rely on pure discipline, is far more effective.
In the greatest documentary of all time, The Unbelievable Ronnie Coleman, he has a W.L. Bateman quote pasted to the mirror in his bedroom. It goes like this:
“If you keep on doing what you’ve always done, you’ll keep on getting what you’ve always got.”
This is the essential mindset of change. It’s the truth that Buddha awoke to under the bodhi tree: paṭiccasamuppāda or idappaccayatā. Dependent or conditional origination:
“If this exists, that exists; if this ceases to exist, that also ceases to exist”
Change the causes, change the effects.
“. Despite the fact that no differences in calorie intake were observed between groups, the fructose animals displayed significantly increased BW, liver mass and fat mass in comparison to the glucose group. This was further accompanied by a significant reduction in physical activity in the fructose animals. ”
Naturedotcom/articles/srep09589
“In the last 40 years, fructose, a simple carbohydrate derived from fruit and vegetables, has been on the increase in American diets. Because of the addition of high-fructose corn syrup to many soft drinks and processed baked goods, fructose currently accounts for 10 percent of caloric intake for U.S. citizens.”
sciencedailyDOTcom/releases//06/150601122540DOThtm
Fruits ripen in the fall. Animals eat the fruits. The ones that put on fat and keep that fat might survive winter better.
“. Despite the fact that no differences in calorie intake were observed between groups, the fructose animals displayed significantly increased BW, liver mass and fat mass in comparison to the glucose group. This was further accompanied by a significant reduction in physical activity in the fructose animals. ” Naturedotcom/articles/srep09589 “In the last 40 years, fructose, a simple carbohydrate derived from fruit and vegetables, has been on the increase in American diets. Because of the addition of high-fructose corn syrup to many soft drinks and processed baked goods, fructose currently accounts for 10 percent of caloric intake for U.S. citizens.” sciencedailyDOTcom/releases//06/150601122540DOThtm Fruits ripen in the fall. Animals eat the fruits. The ones that put on fat and keep that fat might survive winter better.
The advent of cheap high-fructose corn syrup made “sugar” an ultra-cheap preservative and it ended up being used in everything. If you read your labels, HFCS is everywhere. That said, it isn’t any worse than plain sugar (sucrose). Sucrose is “instantly” decomposed into fructose and glucose by enzymes in saliva and gastric juices – i.e. it’s the same shit. The problem is just that, since the 70’s (when the Japanese invented HFCS), we’ve upped our intake substantially. When I was a kid, lo these many years ago, I had a friend people called “Whale Wally” because he was fat. Today he’d be ‘average’. Look at all the morbidly obese 8-12 year olds. I truly pity the children I see who may never know what it’s like to be able to move well.
-stick
To me, there’s basically no excuse for eating processed food. If you eat shit that came out of a bag or can, you’re deliberately consuming pollution. Sugar is just one of the many harmful things in your typical processed food product.
A totally valid point. However, I must admit to being weak enough that I do at times eat impure foods. It takes a significant amount of energy (in my opinion and experience) to eat clean all the time. Still, I think you can eat commercial food (not shit, not McDonald’s, not 6 fudge-slurpees from Starbucks…) in moderation and be OK. But I do think that sugar (HFCS or ‘table sugar’) is significantly worse than methyl paraben or blue #4…
-stick
To me, there’s basically no excuse for eating processed food. If you eat shit that came out of a bag or can, you’re deliberately consuming pollution. Sugar is just one of the many harmful things in your typical processed food product.
A totally valid point. However, I must admit to being weak enough that I do at times eat impure foods. It takes a significant amount of energy (in my opinion and experience) to eat clean all the time. Still, I think you can eat commercial food (not shit, not McDonald’s, not 6 fudge-slurpees from Starbucks…) in moderation and be OK. But I do think that sugar (HFCS or ‘table sugar’) is significantly worse than methyl paraben or blue #4… -stick
It’s all good. If you’re lean, you have more latitude, if not, you don’t. I’m not your judge and I have no moral high ground but we should have the mental clarity to face the truth. As a starting point, fat people should not eat any processed foods, sugar or otherwise. The average American woman is a UFC middleweight for Christ’s sake. We are in a very dark timeline.
The advent of cheap high-fructose corn syrup made “sugar” an ultra-cheap preservative and it ended up being used in everything. If you read your labels, HFCS is everywhere. That said, it isn’t any worse than plain sugar (sucrose). Sucrose is “instantly” decomposed into fructose and glucose by enzymes in saliva and gastric juices – i.e. it’s the same shit. The problem is just that, since the 70’s (when the Japanese invented HFCS), we’ve upped our intake substantially. When I was a kid, lo these many years ago, I had a friend people called “Whale Wally” because he was fat. Today he’d be ‘average’. Look at all the morbidly obese 8-12 year olds. I truly pity the children I see who may never know what it’s like to be able to move well. -stick
Table sugar is a dimer of glucose and fructose, that’s true. The above animal studies show what they show. Fructose paced fat rentention and ‘torpor’.
You made a point, I went and looked in the above study. The lab diets used pure glucose or pure fructose. They did not use HFCS versus Table sugar. This would have been a more “representative” comparison.
natureDOTcom/articles/srep09589/tables/1
Another guess…….
Could be that the American taste for sugar has blunted people’s abilities to taste it. We’ve become conditioned to wanting more and more “sweetness” in our foods? Consumer testing is driving manufacturers to put more and more sugar in.
I notice this sweetness because I eat keto. Most American foods taste sickeningly sweet to me.
Attempt #3 (links no longer work…)
OK, a bit less verbose, but I suggested watching Sugar, the Bitter Truth and reading The Case Against Sugar . The latter does refer to a book by the presenter in the former, but there’s quite a bit more than that. The Case Against Sugar makes a fairly compelling argument that sugar *is* an addictive substance – something that casual observation bears out.
If there are any hard-and-fast nutrition rules that I believe, they are “sugar is bad” and “get more fiber”. (I suppose “get more protein” would fit too, except that I’ve never had that shortcoming…).
All this I say by way of discourse as we’ve pretty much ignored the massive shift to an ultra-sedentary lifestyle in first-world nations.
-stick
Attempt #3 (links no longer work…) OK, a bit less verbose, but I suggested watching Sugar, the Bitter Truth and reading The Case Against Sugar . The latter does refer to a book by the presenter in the former, but there’s quite a bit more than that. The Case Against Sugar makes a fairly compelling argument that sugar *is* an addictive substance – something that casual observation bears out. If there are any hard-and-fast nutrition rules that I believe, they are “sugar is bad” and “get more fiber”. (I suppose “get more protein” would fit too, except that I’ve never had that shortcoming…). All this I say by way of discourse as we’ve pretty much ignored the massive shift to an ultra-sedentary lifestyle in first-world nations. -stick
In general, highly concentrated forms of carbohydrates seem to either be drugs or have “drug-like” effects on the body, in that the dosage is way beyond most natural sources that people encountered in the evolutionary past. Whereas, concentrated forms of protein and fat are not so hard to find. Whether that means it should be controlled, or at minimum that government should not subsidize it, is an open question.
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