Presidential Election 2016 (was "Debates")

[dead man walking]

yesterday, the nytimes did a decent piece on trump's "income."

On the financial disclosure forms that Donald J. Trump has pointed to as proof of his tremendous success, no venture looks more gold-plated than his golf resort in Doral, Fla., where he reported revenues of $50 million in 2014. That figure accounted for the biggest share of what he described as his income for the year.

But this summer, a considerably different picture emerged in an austere government hearing room in Miami, where Mr. Trump’s company was challenging the resort’s property tax bill.

Mr. Trump’s lawyer handed the magistrate an income and expense statement showing that the gross revenue had indeed been $50 million. But after paying operating costs, the resort had actually lost $2.4 million.

as nafod so eloquently said, heh

[bennyonesix]

Stop with the facebook tier fagsnark. Spell it out. What does this data point prove? And how does it prove it?

[The Ginger Beard Man]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

[Yes I Have Balls]

I refuse to read this thread. But Trump will win. The majority approach was rejected by GOP because it woukd work. White disaffected voters are still largest minority. Trump will beat Romney and get many more ind and Dem crossovers. Brothers aren't motivated and Hillary will underperform BO in every demo but blue haired cat ladies. Turnout will be huge and disaffected voters will go almost entirely to Trump.

OH, FL, PA, VA, NH, NC and at least one of MI, WI,MIN.

That is right now. Wait until the preference cascade kicks in.

Suck it shitlibs.

You are why this country is in trouble.

[Yes I Have Balls]

You admire a murdering piece of shit

Cite please? Thanks!

[bennyonesix]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

You seem a well meaning guy and reflective. So, I have to ask, you listened to Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan say that Hillary is horrible beyond imagining and drew the conclusion that you should vote for her? You know who those two are, right? Their biases? A serious question.

[The Ginger Beard Man]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

You seem a well meaning guy and reflective. So, I have to ask, you listened to Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan say that Hillary is horrible beyond imagining and drew the conclusion that you should vote for her? You know who those two are, right? Their biases? A serious question.

Trump is uniquely unqualified to be President. He doesn't know how little he knows, and doesn't make an effort to learn. He can't even be bother to prepare for a debate. He has made no serious policy proposals. He has made contradictory statements. His answer to everything is "I'll make it better."
He's dangerously ignorant.

[bennyonesix]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

You seem a well meaning guy and reflective. So, I have to ask, you listened to Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan say that Hillary is horrible beyond imagining and drew the conclusion that you should vote for her? You know who those two are, right? Their biases? A serious question.

Trump is uniquely unqualified to be President. He doesn't know how little he knows, and doesn't make an effort to learn. He can't even be bother to prepare for a debate. He has made no serious policy proposals. He has made contradictory statements. His answer to everything is "I'll make it better."
He's dangerously ignorant.

I think this is wrong. I have been to hear him and listened and looked at his proposals. I think they are serious. I also don't hold any politician to policy papers. All that goes out the window once you hit office.

"Uniquely unqualified" and "no serious policy proposals" and "dangerously ignorant" are thought ending phrases. Do you have the historical understanding to say those things? Or are you repeating phrases for totemic value? Because they mean almost nothing to me. And they don't sound like you write normally. Your posts are usually free from such vague statements.

[nafod]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

You seem a well meaning guy and reflective. So, I have to ask, you listened to Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan say that Hillary is horrible beyond imagining and drew the conclusion that you should vote for her? You know who those two are, right? Their biases? A serious question.

Trump is uniquely unqualified to be President. He doesn't know how little he knows, and doesn't make an effort to learn. He can't even be bother to prepare for a debate. He has made no serious policy proposals. He has made contradictory statements. His answer to everything is "I'll make it better."
He's dangerously ignorant.

I think this is wrong. I have been to hear him and listened and looked at his proposals. I think they are serious.

He gets baited by overweight beauty contestants into tweet battles.

[bennyonesix]

What are her egregious corruptions and evils that aren't endemic to the American political class?

Actually, this statement here explains Trump much more accurately than your dismissal of his voters as just a bunch of ignorant bigots. Once again, listen to that Sam Harris podcast.
And no, Milosz, I don't mean you. You're hopeless. I mean people who actually want a worthwhile discussion of this.

As for Trump the businessman, he was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple. Anyone who is paying attention can see that. It's a shame he was the only one willing to respond to Milosz's point quoted above.

You seem a well meaning guy and reflective. So, I have to ask, you listened to Sam Harris and Andrew Sullivan say that Hillary is horrible beyond imagining and drew the conclusion that you should vote for her? You know who those two are, right? Their biases? A serious question.

Trump is uniquely unqualified to be President. He doesn't know how little he knows, and doesn't make an effort to learn. He can't even be bother to prepare for a debate. He has made no serious policy proposals. He has made contradictory statements. His answer to everything is "I'll make it better."
He's dangerously ignorant.

I think this is wrong. I have been to hear him and listened and looked at his proposals. I think they are serious.

He gets baited by overweight beauty contestants into tweet battles.

That's great. Good point.

[powerlifter54]

Trump wasn't my first choice, but Hilliary is my last choice. She is corrupt, evil, and is the femanifestation of all the cabal of banks,media, government, and DC hangers on that is the root of most of the problems in the US today. Not to mention so either arrogant or stupid or both to set up a private server to do classified State Department Business while posting an "Influence for Sale" shingle.

it is interesting to note when Trump defends himself from 60lb weight gaining baby mommas to drug dealers, from last minute allegations of harassment, and a Muslim Sharia advocate and immigration attorney, we get to hear the cabal all stick to the same talking points of he can't respond to that, Hilliary responds with plain and obvious lies in her denials and it is reviewed as genius. A much better set of men, GW and Mitt Romney plaid the cabal game of Repubs not responding to lies and it didn't work out so well. That tactic is forever changed from Trump's example. And this email/Clinton Crime Family/Security breach problem is not going away. Even if she wins, and Obama pardons her and her whole staff, the damage is done.

As for policy if you think the economy is booming, then vote for Hilliary. But most are living with the fact it isn't booming for them. Jobs are the answer. Trump says manufacturing jobs, Hilliary proposes government jobs. You pick. If you think a wall doesn't work or open borders are the shizzle then she is your gal. Most folks outside of the northeast and Cali have a different opinion. if you think renewable energy is already figured out and we should stop drilling and piping again Clinton Clinton Clinton. If you think health care was improved by Obamacare do the deed for more of that mess. Finally if you think our foreign policy of the last 8 years, and furthermore the last 20, was incredible, then again Hill and Bill for the thrill. A lot of us and our kids are tired of deploying to patch up problems that seem so easy in the working groups and think tanks and Sunday talk shows.

The bottom line is all that Trump is not have been qualities that haven't amounted to jack shit for our country. He is a wrench in the machine. The machine needs to go. It won't be pretty if he wins. But it won't be the same old same old Investment Bank/Think Tank/College President/Political Appointee Mess we have had for a long, long time.

Let the games begin. May the odds be with you.

[dead man walking]

The government, delivering the last major snapshot of the economy before Election Day, reported on Friday that employers added 161,000 workers in October, a performance that suggested a healthy outlook for the months ahead.

The official unemployment rate dropped to 4.9 percent, from 5 percent. And average hourly earnings rose 2.8 percent year over year, a level not reached since 2008.

“It was pretty positive across the board,” said David Berson, chief economist at Nationwide Insurance, adding that “most importantly, we got a nice jump in average hourly earnings and that actually corresponds with other data.”

no thanks to obstructionist republicans

[powerlifter54]

While Labor Force participation rate ticked down, again, the problem is in the perception of the Average Working American who doesn't see or feel any wage increase.

From the WSJ

Wage-Growth Gains Bypass Most Workers

The wage growth story is looking worse the more we sift through the data. This is why we said you need to read past the headlines.

See if you can spot the problem. Here is the pertinent paragraph in the BLS release:

"In October, average hourly earnings for all employees on private nonfarm payrolls rose by 10 cents to $25.92, following an 8-cent increase in September. Over the year, average hourly earnings have risen by 2.8 percent. Average hourly earnings of private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees increased by 4 cents to $21.72 in October."

So, the number that got everybody excited was the 2.8% year-over-year gain for average hourly earnings. It's certainly not a bad number, indeed it's the best since June 2009. It's just that the number comes with a couple of very big caveats.

Problem one: It's hourly. Weekly earnings were up 2.5% from a year ago. Weekly earnings are more indicative of a person's actual financial condition than hourly earnings, and 2.5% is pretty much where we've been all along. So that's a letdown.

Problem two, and this is the bigger problem: The 2.8% gain is for all employees. For "private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees" the gain was only 2.5%. On a weekly basis, it the gain for this group was 2.1%. Why does that matter? Well, "private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees" is a group that comprises four-fifths of the entire work force.

In other words, a small sliver of the work force saw those larger wage gains. For the vast majority of American workers, wage growth is still anemic, barely outrunning official measures of inflation, which was 1.5% in September, according to the most recent CPI report.
Paul Vigna

[Yes I Have Balls]

Trump wasn't my first choice, but Hilliary is my last choice. She is corrupt, evil, and is the femanifestation of all the cabal of banks,media, government, and DC hangers on that is the root of most of the problems in the US today. Not to mention so either arrogant or stupid or both to set up a private server to do classified State Department Business while posting an "Influence for Sale" shingle.

it is interesting to note when Trump defends himself from 60lb weight gaining baby mommas to drug dealers, from last minute allegations of harassment, and a Muslim Sharia advocate and immigration attorney, we get to hear the cabal all stick to the same talking points of he can't respond to that, Hilliary responds with plain and obvious lies in her denials and it is reviewed as genius. A much better set of men, GW and Mitt Romney plaid the cabal game of Repubs not responding to lies and it didn't work out so well. That tactic is forever changed from Trump's example. And this email/Clinton Crime Family/Security breach problem is not going away. Even if she wins, and Obama pardons her and her whole staff, the damage is done.

As for policy if you think the economy is booming, then vote for Hilliary. But most are living with the fact it isn't booming for them. Jobs are the answer. Trump says manufacturing jobs, Hilliary proposes government jobs. You pick. If you think a wall doesn't work or open borders are the shizzle then she is your gal. Most folks outside of the northeast and Cali have a different opinion. if you think renewable energy is already figured out and we should stop drilling and piping again Clinton Clinton Clinton. If you think health care was improved by Obamacare do the deed for more of that mess. Finally if you think our foreign policy of the last 8 years, and furthermore the last 20, was incredible, then again Hill and Bill for the thrill. A lot of us and our kids are tired of deploying to patch up problems that seem so easy in the working groups and think tanks and Sunday talk shows.

The bottom line is all that Trump is not have been qualities that haven't amounted to jack shit for our country. He is a wrench in the machine. The machine needs to go. It won't be pretty if he wins. But it won't be the same old same old Investment Bank/Think Tank/College President/Political Appointee Mess we have had for a long, long time.

Let the games begin. May the odds be with you.

Look, 70% of what you said is false, 35% is opinion presented as fact and 50% is bullshit.

You literally do not have a clue what could happen if Trump wins. Not one. "He's the wrench in the machine" is Top 10 most ignorant things I have read here, and that is saying a fucking metric shit ton. You want to set fire to the Republic and dance around it naked with a vote for Trump? I'd rather you kill yourself first.

[The Ginger Beard Man]

While Labor Force participation rate ticked down, again, the problem is in the perception of the Average Working American who doesn't see or feel any wage increase.

From the WSJ

Wage-Growth Gains Bypass Most Workers

The wage growth story is looking worse the more we sift through the data. This is why we said you need to read past the headlines.

See if you can spot the problem. Here is the pertinent paragraph in the BLS release:

"In October, average hourly earnings for all employees on private nonfarm payrolls rose by 10 cents to $25.92, following an 8-cent increase in September. Over the year, average hourly earnings have risen by 2.8 percent. Average hourly earnings of private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees increased by 4 cents to $21.72 in October."

So, the number that got everybody excited was the 2.8% year-over-year gain for average hourly earnings. It's certainly not a bad number, indeed it's the best since June 2009. It's just that the number comes with a couple of very big caveats.

Problem one: It's hourly. Weekly earnings were up 2.5% from a year ago. Weekly earnings are more indicative of a person's actual financial condition than hourly earnings, and 2.5% is pretty much where we've been all along. So that's a letdown.

Problem two, and this is the bigger problem: The 2.8% gain is for all employees. For "private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees" the gain was only 2.5%. On a weekly basis, it the gain for this group was 2.1%. Why does that matter? Well, "private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees" is a group that comprises four-fifths of the entire work force.

In other words, a small sliver of the work force saw those larger wage gains. For the vast majority of American workers, wage growth is still anemic, barely outrunning official measures of inflation, which was 1.5% in September, according to the most recent CPI report.
Paul Vigna

Funny you mention the WSJ journal.
After offering buyouts two weeks ago, they started laying people off this week.

Those unemployment figures will likely be revised in three months to something less favorable to Obama, as has happened often in recent years.

And who can forget in the early 2000s, when W was prez and unemployment fell to around 5% and democrats constantly shouted "jobless recovery" and "Wall St vs Main Street"?
Partisan democrats can, that's who.

[dead man walking]

of course i should have known that any positive news during the obama years is mere illusion.

as for the wall street journal, it's problems are no doubt typical of print media and unrelated to the jobs and wages report. in contrast, i believe i recently saw that the times has posted strong earnings.

[powerlifter54]

Trump wasn't my first choice, but Hilliary is my last choice. She is corrupt, evil, and is the femanifestation of all the cabal of banks,media, government, and DC hangers on that is the root of most of the problems in the US today. Not to mention so either arrogant or stupid or both to set up a private server to do classified State Department Business while posting an "Influence for Sale" shingle.

it is interesting to note when Trump defends himself from 60lb weight gaining baby mommas to drug dealers, from last minute allegations of harassment, and a Muslim Sharia advocate and immigration attorney, we get to hear the cabal all stick to the same talking points of he can't respond to that, Hilliary responds with plain and obvious lies in her denials and it is reviewed as genius. A much better set of men, GW and Mitt Romney plaid the cabal game of Repubs not responding to lies and it didn't work out so well. That tactic is forever changed from Trump's example. And this email/Clinton Crime Family/Security breach problem is not going away. Even if she wins, and Obama pardons her and her whole staff, the damage is done.

As for policy if you think the economy is booming, then vote for Hilliary. But most are living with the fact it isn't booming for them. Jobs are the answer. Trump says manufacturing jobs, Hilliary proposes government jobs. You pick. If you think a wall doesn't work or open borders are the shizzle then she is your gal. Most folks outside of the northeast and Cali have a different opinion. if you think renewable energy is already figured out and we should stop drilling and piping again Clinton Clinton Clinton. If you think health care was improved by Obamacare do the deed for more of that mess. Finally if you think our foreign policy of the last 8 years, and furthermore the last 20, was incredible, then again Hill and Bill for the thrill. A lot of us and our kids are tired of deploying to patch up problems that seem so easy in the working groups and think tanks and Sunday talk shows.

The bottom line is all that Trump is not have been qualities that haven't amounted to jack shit for our country. He is a wrench in the machine. The machine needs to go. It won't be pretty if he wins. But it won't be the same old same old Investment Bank/Think Tank/College President/Political Appointee Mess we have had for a long, long time.

Let the games begin. May the odds be with you.

Look, 70% of what you said is false, 35% is opinion presented as fact and 50% is bullshit.

You literally do not have a clue what could happen if Trump wins. Not one. "He's the wrench in the machine" is Top 10 most ignorant things I have read here, and that is saying a fucking metric shit ton. You want to set fire to the Republic and dance around it naked with a vote for Trump? I'd rather you kill yourself first.

So break down the 70%, the 35%, and the 50%. I won't hold you to any sum, just wag it.

You run your mouth a lot. Good luck with that.

[The Ginger Beard Man]

of course i should have known that any positive news during the obama years is mere illusion.

as for the wall street journal, it's problems are no doubt typical of print media and unrelated to the jobs and wages report. in contrast, i believe i recently saw that the times has posted strong earnings.

No doubt. The print journalism business is a mess. This also helps to explain how the newsmedia failed so spectacularly in exposing Trump in the primaries.
QE, reinflation of the housing bubble, the rise of the real estate bubble, continued growth in income inequality, those are another topic. Unless you want four more years of the same.

[tough old man]

either way.

[bennyonesix]

of course i should have known that any positive news during the obama years is mere illusion.

as for the wall street journal, it's problems are no doubt typical of print media and unrelated to the jobs and wages report. in contrast, i believe i recently saw that the times has posted strong earnings.

No doubt. The print journalism business is a mess. This also helps to explain how the newsmedia failed so spectacularly in exposing Trump in the primaries.
QE, reinflation of the housing bubble, the rise of the real estate bubble, continued growth in income inequality, those are another topic. Unless you want four more years of the same.

Add in the biggest bubble: student loans. And the wars. And the lawless Supreme Court. And the actually massive and unprecedented increase in executive authority. And uncontrolled immigration. And stagnant wages. And demogtaphic displacement.

How is Trump worse than this?

[bennyonesix]

of course i should have known that any positive news during the obama years is mere illusion.

as for the wall street journal, it's problems are no doubt typical of print media and unrelated to the jobs and wages report. in contrast, i believe i recently saw that the times has posted strong earnings.

New York Times Co. said its third-quarter earnings fell sharply as print advertising dropped 19%, the latest publisher to signal that spending on newspaper ads is drying up even further.

Publishers have made plans to further trim their staffs and shift resources to more digital initiatives as advertising demand is forecast to remain weak. The New York Times said its overall advertising revenue decreased 7.7% in the third quarter, and the company expects a similar decline for the fourth quarter. Digital advertising sales, meanwhile, grew 21%, mostly on growth in its mobile platform.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/new-york-ti ... 1478092100

[bennyonesix]

either way.

You all will be happy to note I bought another shotgun.

[bennyonesix]

Trump wasn't my first choice, but Hilliary is my last choice. She is corrupt, evil, and is the femanifestation of all the cabal of banks,media, government, and DC hangers on that is the root of most of the problems in the US today. Not to mention so either arrogant or stupid or both to set up a private server to do classified State Department Business while posting an "Influence for Sale" shingle.

it is interesting to note when Trump defends himself from 60lb weight gaining baby mommas to drug dealers, from last minute allegations of harassment, and a Muslim Sharia advocate and immigration attorney, we get to hear the cabal all stick to the same talking points of he can't respond to that, Hilliary responds with plain and obvious lies in her denials and it is reviewed as genius. A much better set of men, GW and Mitt Romney plaid the cabal game of Repubs not responding to lies and it didn't work out so well. That tactic is forever changed from Trump's example. And this email/Clinton Crime Family/Security breach problem is not going away. Even if she wins, and Obama pardons her and her whole staff, the damage is done.

As for policy if you think the economy is booming, then vote for Hilliary. But most are living with the fact it isn't booming for them. Jobs are the answer. Trump says manufacturing jobs, Hilliary proposes government jobs. You pick. If you think a wall doesn't work or open borders are the shizzle then she is your gal. Most folks outside of the northeast and Cali have a different opinion. if you think renewable energy is already figured out and we should stop drilling and piping again Clinton Clinton Clinton. If you think health care was improved by Obamacare do the deed for more of that mess. Finally if you think our foreign policy of the last 8 years, and furthermore the last 20, was incredible, then again Hill and Bill for the thrill. A lot of us and our kids are tired of deploying to patch up problems that seem so easy in the working groups and think tanks and Sunday talk shows.

The bottom line is all that Trump is not have been qualities that haven't amounted to jack shit for our country. He is a wrench in the machine. The machine needs to go. It won't be pretty if he wins. But it won't be the same old same old Investment Bank/Think Tank/College President/Political Appointee Mess we have had for a long, long time.

Let the games begin. May the odds be with you.

There was a time when someone openly monetizing US Foreign Policy to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars and telling Int'l Finance that she has a public anti-finance face and private pro-finance face was disqualifying.

[climber511]

Both candidates should have been disqualified long ago - one of these clowns will win - but the people lose big time either way.

[dead man walking]

of course i should have known that any positive news during the obama years is mere illusion.

as for the wall street journal, it's problems are no doubt typical of print media and unrelated to the jobs and wages report. in contrast, i believe i recently saw that the times has posted strong earnings.

New York Times Co. said its third-quarter earnings fell sharply as print advertising dropped 19%, the latest publisher to signal that spending on newspaper ads is drying up even further.

Publishers have made plans to further trim their staffs and shift resources to more digital initiatives as advertising demand is forecast to remain weak. The New York Times said its overall advertising revenue decreased 7.7% in the third quarter, and the company expects a similar decline for the fourth quarter. Digital advertising sales, meanwhile, grew 21%, mostly on growth in its mobile platform.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/new-york-ti ... 1478092100

it was the digital performance that caught my eye:

Digital advertising revenue, however, which now represents 36 percent of the company’s advertising revenue, increased 21 percent in the quarter, to $44 million, a welcome relief for the company after a decline in digital advertising last quarter. The Times also added 116,000 net digital-only subscriptions for news products during the quarter, bringing its total to 1.3 million. Including crossword product subscriptions, it has about 1.6 million digital-only subscribers.