IGX

Gin Master wrote:

The One True Rant wrote:

chubbyhubby wrote:11-04-2005, 10:53 AM #8
John Walsh
Banned

For the record I drank the Kool Aid and will drink it again. I like the Kool Aid! I’m not leaving the “ranch” unless Coach tells me that’s what I should do.

http://board.crossfit.com/showthread.ph ... #post24959

Which is exactly what he did.

I actually read through this thread. At one time you could have a discussion about these things. The group think was always there but there were plenty of cats in the early days that could think for themselves. Oddly it was this kind of discussion that got us all bannned. I don't think any of us did anything over the top. It was simply a purge.

And, to be fair, @F then was much different than @F now. There is some decent stuff in there between 2005-2007.

Nothing wrong with Oly, PL, KBs, bodyweight, Plyos, Running, Rings, or Cross Training when done with a reason and a limit. The issue then that was developing, and what ultimately blossomed into what is now a plague, was cult like behavior and slavish adherance to one size fits all platitudes about laying it all on the line for a PR in random acts of gym class. Reading that thread is a case study in foreshadowing.

powerlifter54 wrote:Nothing wrong with Oly, PL, KBs, bodyweight, Plyos, Running, Rings, or Cross Training when done with a reason and a limit. The issue then that was developing, and what ultimately blossomed into what is now a plague, was cult like behavior and slavish adherance to one size fits all platitudes about laying it all on the line for a PR in random acts of gym class.

Bad for S&C.

Good for profit!

powerlifter54 wrote:

Gin Master wrote:And, to be fair, @F then was much different than @F now. There is some decent stuff in there between 2005-2007.

Nothing wrong with Oly, PL, KBs, bodyweight, Plyos, Running, Rings, or Cross Training when done with a reason and a limit. The issue then that was developing, and what ultimately blossomed into what is now a plague, was cult like behavior and slavish adherance to one size fits all platitudes about laying it all on the line for a PR in random acts of gym class. Reading that thread is a case study in foreshadowing.

So this begs the question: Who exactly ruined @F? Does this fall squarely on Couch, his acolytes/sycophants, or both? I noticed somewhat more logical work in that same 2005-2007 timeframe compared to now, so WTF happened?

friedquads wrote:So this begs the question: Who exactly ruined @F? Does this fall squarely on Couch, his acolytes/sycophants, or both? I noticed somewhat more logical work in that same 2005-2007 timeframe compared to now, so WTF happened?

Really?? It seems obvious. Couch happened.

friedquads wrote:

powerlifter54 wrote:

Gin Master wrote:And, to be fair, @F then was much different than @F now. There is some decent stuff in there between 2005-2007.

Nothing wrong with Oly, PL, KBs, bodyweight, Plyos, Running, Rings, or Cross Training when done with a reason and a limit. The issue then that was developing, and what ultimately blossomed into what is now a plague, was cult like behavior and slavish adherance to one size fits all platitudes about laying it all on the line for a PR in random acts of gym class. Reading that thread is a case study in foreshadowing.

So this begs the question: Who exactly ruined @F? Does this fall squarely on Couch, his acolytes/sycophants, or both? I noticed somewhat more logical work in that same 2005-2007 timeframe compared to now, so WTF happened?

Just because exercise selection is halfway decent doesn't make the programming any less retarded. What is remarkable is that it's done as well as it has.

The success can be attributed mostly to images of girls on light doses of steroids, fake boobs, no clothing, and knee-high socks.

Gin Master wrote:

The One True Rant wrote:

chubbyhubby wrote:11-04-2005, 10:53 AM #8
John Walsh
Banned

For the record I drank the Kool Aid and will drink it again. I like the Kool Aid! I’m not leaving the “ranch” unless Coach tells me that’s what I should do.

http://board.crossfit.com/showthread.ph ... #post24959

Which is exactly what he did.

I actually read through this thread. At one time you could have a discussion about these things. The group think was always there but there were plenty of cats in the early days that could think for themselves. Oddly it was this kind of discussion that got us all bannned. I don't think any of us did anything over the top. It was simply a purge.

And, to be fair, @F then was much different than @F now. There is some decent stuff in there between 2005-2007.

I think the party ended in 2005. It was exciting and couch was on to some great ideas at the beginning. . He might not have invented them but no one was putting this shit out there is the fashion he was and it was all free. I think he was getting some solid temperament by guys like DJ, Twight and Shaf among others. I can remember discussing the back squat with couch. He didn’t include backs squats at the time but after some back and forth he relented. There was a time you could actually discuss these things with couch. Then he went all Kim Jong-Il and started drinking alcoholically and shit. Once he released the dogs it was a mini Cultural Revolution. We were all unceremoniously exiled. The thing is we brought more to CF then they gave us. Couch thought it went the other way. That’s what makes it so comical. Now CF is nothing more than a Curves but instead of fat chicks its douchebag yuppies, rural cops, volunteer firefighters, trophy wives and military types that work in the mess hall and the laundry.

90% of you that post here had nothing to do with that ground floor CF stuff. You’re all wannabes and posers. We (and we know who we are) were actually contributing ideas and got shit canned for disagreeing. Most of you either quit or were dumped for some sophomoric prank like calling Lynn Pitts a cunt or something. You’re outrage and disgust is inauthentic. You’re presence here is contemptible.

Grandpa's Spells wrote:
The success can be attributed mostly to images of girls on light doses of steroids, fake boobs, no clothing, and knee-high socks.

Bless their hearts.

The One True Rant wrote:I think the party ended in 2005. It was exciting and couch was on to some great ideas at the beginning. . He might not have invented them but no one was putting this shit out there is the fashion he was and it was all free. I think he was getting some solid temperament by guys like DJ, Twight and Shaf among others. I can remember discussing the back squat with couch. He didn’t include backs squats at the time but after some back and forth he relented. There was a time you could actually discuss these things with couch. Then he went all Kim Jong-Il and started drinking alcoholically and shit. Once he released the dogs it was a mini Cultural Revolution. We were all unceremoniously exiled. The thing is we brought more to CF then they gave us. Couch thought it went the other way. That’s what makes it so comical. Now CF is nothing more than a Curves but instead of fat chicks its douchebag yuppies, rural cops, volunteer firefighters, trophy wives and military types that work in the mess hall and the laundry.

90% of you that post here had nothing to do with that ground floor CF stuff. You’re all wannabes and posers. We (and we know who we are) were actually contributing ideas and got shit canned for disagreeing. Most of you either quit or were dumped for some sophomoric prank like calling Lynn Pitts a cunt or something. You’re outrage and disgust is inauthentic. You’re presence here is contemptible.

LULZ at you thinking shaped the future of @F (if you did, then you are responsible for the BS it is today).

Since you're such an insider, tell us all why Couch never cared for the squat (I have alluded to this several times in this thread).

Holy shit my account is still active over there.

And as much as hate bust your bubble Rant I believe I may predate you when it comes to the @fit madness but I could be wrong.

I got in, got some minor injuries, got weaker than piss, and got the fuck out.

What's odd is that I've been doing mainly endurance work and cattleball supplement work and I'm still stronger than I was after doing @fit and I've suffered less injuries.

The One True Rant wrote:

Gin Master wrote:

The One True Rant wrote:

chubbyhubby wrote:11-04-2005, 10:53 AM #8
John Walsh
Banned

For the record I drank the Kool Aid and will drink it again. I like the Kool Aid! I’m not leaving the “ranch” unless Coach tells me that’s what I should do.

http://board.crossfit.com/showthread.ph ... #post24959

Which is exactly what he did.

I actually read through this thread. At one time you could have a discussion about these things. The group think was always there but there were plenty of cats in the early days that could think for themselves. Oddly it was this kind of discussion that got us all bannned. I don't think any of us did anything over the top. It was simply a purge.

And, to be fair, @F then was much different than @F now. There is some decent stuff in there between 2005-2007.

I think the party ended in 2005. It was exciting and couch was on to some great ideas at the beginning. . He might not have invented them but no one was putting this shit out there is the fashion he was and it was all free. I think he was getting some solid temperament by guys like DJ, Twight and Shaf among others. I can remember discussing the back squat with couch. He didn’t include backs squats at the time but after some back and forth he relented. There was a time you could actually discuss these things with couch. Then he went all Kim Jong-Il and started drinking alcoholically and shit. Once he released the dogs it was a mini Cultural Revolution. We were all unceremoniously exiled. The thing is we brought more to CF then they gave us. Couch thought it went the other way. That’s what makes it so comical. Now CF is nothing more than a Curves but instead of fat chicks its douchebag yuppies, rural cops, volunteer firefighters, trophy wives and military types that work in the mess hall and the laundry.

90% of you that post here had nothing to do with that ground floor CF stuff. You’re all wannabes and posers. We (and we know who we are) were actually contributing ideas and got shit canned for disagreeing. Most of you either quit or were dumped for some sophomoric prank like calling Lynn Pitts a cunt or something. You’re outrage and disgust is inauthentic. You’re presence here is contemptible.

For once, I actually sorta, kinda, halfway agree with something Rant said.

Gin Master wrote:

The One True Rant wrote:I think the party ended in 2005. It was exciting and couch was on to some great ideas at the beginning. . He might not have invented them but no one was putting this shit out there is the fashion he was and it was all free. I think he was getting some solid temperament by guys like DJ, Twight and Shaf among others. I can remember discussing the back squat with couch. He didn’t include backs squats at the time but after some back and forth he relented. There was a time you could actually discuss these things with couch. Then he went all Kim Jong-Il and started drinking alcoholically and shit. Once he released the dogs it was a mini Cultural Revolution. We were all unceremoniously exiled. The thing is we brought more to CF then they gave us. Couch thought it went the other way. That’s what makes it so comical. Now CF is nothing more than a Curves but instead of fat chicks its douchebag yuppies, rural cops, volunteer firefighters, trophy wives and military types that work in the mess hall and the laundry.

90% of you that post here had nothing to do with that ground floor CF stuff. You’re all wannabes and posers. We (and we know who we are) were actually contributing ideas and got shit canned for disagreeing. Most of you either quit or were dumped for some sophomoric prank like calling Lynn Pitts a cunt or something. You’re outrage and disgust is inauthentic. You’re presence here is contemptible.

LULZ at you thinking shaped the future of @F (if you did, then you are responsible for the BS it is today).

Since you're such an insider, tell us all why Couch never cared for the squat (I have alluded to this several times in this thread).

Don't be upset with me about your status. Timing is everything my friend. LOL at your claim that couch had polio. It was eradicated in this country in the mid 50s. He thought that the front squat was more athletic and functional than the back squat.

Ed Zachary wrote:Holy shit my account is still active over there.

And as much as hate bust your bubble Rant I believe I may predate you when it comes to the @fit madness but I could be wrong.

I got in, got some minor injuries, got weaker than piss, and got the fuck out.

What's odd is that I've been doing mainly endurance work and cattleball supplement work and I'm still stronger than I was after doing @fit and I've suffered less injuries.

I was involved in 2003 loosely and all in by 2004. I was cited in several of the early CF journals and was invited on more than one occasion to give a talk at one of the certs. I declined because that was never my thing. I train serious but no longer care to discuss things on a serious level because this an era where everyone thinks they have all the answers. So go get fucked up the ass.


I am also in constant contact with the originator of this thread. We have broken bread.

The One True Rant wrote: I am also in constant contact with the originator of this thread. We have broken bread.

i knew there was a back story to the War on Blockiness.

The One True Rant wrote: LOL at your claim that couch had polio. It was eradicated in this country in the mid 50s.

From the CDC:

Is polio still a disease seen in the United States?
The last cases of naturally occurring paralytic polio in the United States were in 1979, when an outbreak occurred among the Amish in several Midwestern states. From 1980 through 1999, there were 152 confirmed cases of paralytic polio cases reported. Of the 152 cases, eight cases were acquired outside the United States and imported. The last imported case caused by wild poliovirus into the United States was reported in 1993. The remaining 144 cases were vaccine-associated paralytic polio (VAPP) caused by live oral polio vaccine (OPV).

The One True Rant wrote:

Ed Zachary wrote:Holy shit my account is still active over there.

And as much as hate bust your bubble Rant I believe I may predate you when it comes to the @fit madness but I could be wrong.

I got in, got some minor injuries, got weaker than piss, and got the fuck out.

What's odd is that I've been doing mainly endurance work and cattleball supplement work and I'm still stronger than I was after doing @fit and I've suffered less injuries.

I was involved in 2003 loosely and all in by 2004. I was cited in several of the early CF journals and was invited on more than one occasion to give a talk at one of the certs. I declined because that was never my thing. I train serious but no longer care to discuss things on a serious level because this an era where everyone thinks they have all the answers. So go get fucked up the ass.


I am also in constant contact with the originator of this thread. We have broken bread.

LOL at you having anything worthwhile to say on training. You are an Internet persona. Nothing more nothing less. Your so called training knowledge and so called athletic achievements are about as real as Garm's Special Forces career.

And please don't project your latent homosexual urges on me, we all know you crave the dark meat.

I've heard polio, I've heard ring injury. I've also heard surfing injury and bike accident. I've also heard that the accident happened while under the influence of something or another. Complete hearsay, but there it is.

I'm speculating the reason Couch didn't like the back squat is because he couldn't fucking do one. If you notice, all the early shit is overhead, air, and ball squats. The back squat also demands to be heavily loaded, which takes away from metcon results.

in 2004 I was on track to be among the first 100 affiliates before a personal crisis prevented that. I remember the old days on the old threaded board where intelligent conversation was present and the fanboys weren't around. I remember the old affiliate board list where we emailed training ideas back and forth.

Back then it wasn't about money or the fame, it was a system that a lot of people really believed in, got results from and the people involved had been in the fitness industry for some time it seems like.

Now you have people who never worked out before they found CF and decide they love it, get their L1's, open gyms and decide to program workouts for dozens of people without any real knowledge of anything exercise outside of CF.

Now you have a cult-like mentality where it breeds extreme narcissism, self-promotion, attention whoring and more.

The problem isn't the system, any system can be good or bed depending on who's hands they are in, the problem is the astronomical growth of it by unqualified people and followers who don't think for themselves.

the system is flawed and it will be broken up before it is fixed.

Ash Uber Alles wrote:the system is flawed and it will be broken up before it is fixed.

You assume the system is designed to do anything other than generate money.

protobuilder wrote:

Ash Uber Alles wrote:the system is flawed and it will be broken up before it is fixed.

You assume the system is designed to do anything other than generate money.

Couch is the new Don Lapre?

protobuilder wrote:

Ash Uber Alles wrote:the system is flawed and it will be broken up before it is fixed.

You assume the system is designed to do anything other than generate money.

good point...

Ash Uber Alles wrote:Now you have people who never worked out before they found CF and decide they love it, get their L1's, open gyms and decide to program workouts for dozens of people without any real knowledge of anything exercise outside of CF.

Now you have a cult-like mentality where it breeds extreme narcissism, self-promotion, attention whoring and more.

This is it right here. That's where my hate originates. Oh, don't forget the eleetizm. Jeez.

Quack Attack wrote:

The One True Rant wrote: LOL at your claim that couch had polio. It was eradicated in this country in the mid 50s.

From the CDC:

Is polio still a disease seen in the United States?
The last cases of naturally occurring paralytic polio in the United States were in 1979, when an outbreak occurred among the Amish in several Midwestern states. From 1980 through 1999, there were 152 confirmed cases of paralytic polio cases reported. Of the 152 cases, eight cases were acquired outside the United States and imported. The last imported case caused by wild poliovirus into the United States was reported in 1993. The remaining 144 cases were vaccine-associated paralytic polio (VAPP) caused by live oral polio vaccine (OPV).

So unless couch grew up Amish the polio explanation is unlikely. I have it from reliable sources that he fell down a flight of stairs drunk, and then passed out in a position that cut off blood flow to his leg leaving him a gimp. This is the most plausible explanation I have heard thus far and like I said the source is reliable.

What did happen?

I really think that posting and competing for the WODs was an issue. One time, the workout was 30 cleans and it was a contest to see who could do the most the fastest. I took 185 and just cranked it and then found out later I lost to a guy who did 135 "faster." That was my first hint that maybe I wasn't going to fit. Competing with formulas, no matter how well intentioned, has always been an issue with me. (Although in the Highland Games, I LOVED decathalon scoring because it gave me so many advantages)

The sexism was another issue, but I should have shown more courage and mentioned it at the time. I blame myself.

I really do think having me and Mark get involved was a big factor in this eroding of decorum. I had that huge experiment with the huge groups doing Xfit and just watching the injuries go through the roof and my athletes getting weaker in tests made me have to move into another direction. Mark was finding the same thing on his end with the endurance athletes. This is before all the nonsense and we were discussing this and this was the first sign of "nobody messes with this." Very interesting time.

Of course, by the time the t-nation thing came out, I had already begun working with Pavel. It took me a couple of years to put "all of this" together into a more coherent vision...and that's really the great insight of my last twenty years or so in the game.

I actually have enjoyed going through these threads. John and Shaf are right about the discussions, esp in the squat. I blame that article I wrote in "Dino Files" for all the Overhead Squat stuff, but there was some issues with teaching most people the squat. I'm not sure people remember how bad squatting was in large groups just ten years ago. I should pat my back a little for turning some of it around, but you can see with the med ball squats and all the rest that there was a lot of issues with squatting performance.

Like the Nautilus and HIT guys, the money generated should be enough to actually put the theories to test. I have told the Nautilus guy, Jim (? the guy with the huge forearms), that they had a great chance to prove their points by sponsoring a lifting team (either Power or O) and prove it on the platform. He said they couldn't because of genetics. Well, prove it with a sport or something.

Whoever is bringing up the old posts, thanks. It has been interesting.

Chubbyhubby is the one that has been cyber stalking me with my old posts from CF. It has ironically had the opposite effect that he intended and has created some interesting discussion on this thread which has been dead in the water for at least a year or so. I think he thought they would embarrass me or cause others to scorn me. LOL on the first count and the second count is yesterday's news.

The big difference is that after they started to chastise the polite heretics, like Rant and myself, things started to turn uglier. Then when Glassman revealed his love for character assassination with Josh Hillis, then Mark Twight, then Dan John, it went off the rails, and was no longer considering any ideas outside the core 'groupthink'.