IGX

Ed Zachary wrote:This. I quit talking to @fitters about their injuries a long time ago. If one starts talking to me and they start talking about their injuries I tell them they know the reason they are hurt and they need to fix it.

This here...
One douche I see all the time is always limping or bent over or tilted on one side when he walks. I thought maybe Shape got to him since he's about 30 and I know Shape likes the young ones.
This guy loves the dumbsh@tfit though, yet is perplexed why he's twisted up or always hurting.

Ol' Andrew Wilson's counting achilles tendon ruptures for the games WODs. He's documented 6 so far, most of them incurred doing box jumps.

6 ruptures of one of the toughest tendons in the body.

Shafpocalypse Now wrote:Ol' Andrew Wilson's counting achilles tendon ruptures for the games WODs. He's documented 6 so far, most of them incurred doing box jumps.

6 ruptures of one of the toughest tendons in the body.

It's pretty terrible. Is this one of the reasons Dan John doesn't program box jumps for his high school athletes?

Dan's reason was simpler. Too many misses = fucked up shins, ankles, and feet.

Shafpocalypse Now wrote:Dan's reason was simpler. Too many misses = fucked up shins, ankles, and feet.

I suppose because Mr John is not stupid enough to coach so negligently as to let the kids do box jumps in a way that would put them at risk for a ruptured tendon. That is to say, for the people who can't add in their heads, he didn't have the kids do tons of reps against the clock. Take note, @Fit lurkers. The CrossFit Games are indeed an experiment in human performance, just like Glassman says. I hope you're beginning to realize that not necessarily a good thing for the test subjects...

tzg wrote:

Shafpocalypse Now wrote:Dan's reason was simpler. Too many misses = fucked up shins, ankles, and feet.

I suppose because Mr John is not stupid enough to coach so negligently as to let the kids do box jumps in a way that would put them at risk for a ruptured tendon. That is to say, for the people who can't add in their heads, he didn't have the kids do tons of reps against the clock. Take note, @Fit lurkers. The CrossFit Games are indeed an experiment in human performance, just like Glassman says. I hope you're beginning to realize that not necessarily a good thing for the test subjects...

Very Josef Mengele.

It's far more than 6 now. This is getting tragic.

Shaf is right, but there is the other side of the issue, too: what is the benefit of Box Jumps? Oh, I know all the guys who sell them and write "cutting edge" articles will tell you x, y and z, but, honestly, the kids who jump well do Box Jumps well and the kids who don't get hurt.

There is such a fine edge with sport, and life come to think of it, that doing something that hurts some people is almost a sin. I have no problem with a kid getting hurt in a football game, but getting hurt doing some dumb ass thing is something else. Now, having adults with no sport specific goal getting jacked up to brag with the white board in a small gym...well, that is just wrong.

My friend, Jim, blew his achilles maybe twenty years ago and it DIDN'T heal! Oh, it works after the surgery, but he is "one sided." At least he blew off playing handball.

So, Box Jumps. I get it. But, I don't see the benefit to the cost.

Always good to see my name in this thread. I have to Bless the "workout that cannot be named" as that single attack on my character back a few years ago basically put my name on the map and more than I ever thought in terms of income.

Yes I Have Balls wrote:

Gin Master wrote:Here's what I don't understand...is why so many people who can't even do these workouts paid $10 to "enter" online? I could understand if this was a physical event; at least you're there. But why film yourself exercising poorly and pay $10 for nobody to watch it?

Indeed. I PROMISE you that not a single back of the pack, AG'er in ANY triathlon in the country would pay $10 for a camera crew to follow them as they struggle through a 2 hour sprint distance race.

Much less pay to have themselves taped and then POST IT ON THE INTERNET FOR THE ENTIRE WORLD TO SEE!

They're extreme athletes, ease up.

Danny John wrote:Shaf is right, but there is the other side of the issue, too: what is the benefit of Box Jumps? Oh, I know all the guys who sell them and write "cutting edge" articles will tell you x, y and z, but, honestly, the kids who jump well do Box Jumps well and the kids who don't get hurt.

So, Box Jumps. I get it. But, I don't see the benefit to the cost.

so, all crackfit hate aside, are box jumps worth a damn for training to jump higher? (assuming you don't injure yourself)

i ask because i'm one of those guys that can easily jump 4-6 inches into the air on demand and while 95% of the time i could care less, i have it in the back of my head that someday i'll work on this particular weakness. of course, i was figuring i could just add box jumps to my routine and achieve a 5 foot vert.

oh, and for all the dingdongs that kablooey their achilles trying to qualify for the games, i too am torn. part of me wishes you a


and another part of me, the part that was there when my porky old uncle ruptured his achilles trying to keep up with his kids on the basketball court, hopes you're not all


nelson is definitely winning though. assfit sucks.

On the bright side, ANYC is clearly training hard again.

Jesus, this is timely. I just had a near knock-down-drag-out w/the affiliate owner here over the gym's programming, after one of the kids here blew his achilles tendon. Kid's a helluva athlete too. Stupid shit like box jumps programmed multiple days in a row, together with burpees and sprinting--shit, it's only a matter of time, something's gonna give out down there. Crisis of conscience for me and all that. I was naive enough to think that if I set a good example, people would come to their senses--well, a few of them anyway--and adopt a more balanced training philosophy.

lesser_rebelangel wrote:Jesus, this is timely. I just had a near knock-down-drag-out w/the affiliate owner here over the gym's programming, after one of the kids here blew his achilles tendon. Kid's a helluva athlete too. Stupid shit like box jumps programmed multiple days in a row, together with burpees and sprinting--shit, it's only a matter of time, something's gonna give out down there. Crisis of conscience for me and all that. I was naive enough to think that if I set a good example, people would come to their senses--well, a few of them anyway--and adopt a more balanced training philosophy.

but... but... the broad time and modal domains! won't somebody think of the broad time and modal domains?!

i feel the need to see her assets unfettered to accurately gauge their resistance to gravity.

I'm a little surprised that nobody's posted this yet.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ8GvVEpoYg[/youtube]

3:20 is where thing go off the rails.

Danny John wrote:Always good to see my name in this thread. I have to Bless the "workout that cannot be named" as that single attack on my character back a few years ago basically put my name on the map and more than I ever thought in terms of income.

It was about 1) having true knowledges and 2) the classy way you handled your departure. Did you ever, in your wildest dreams, think that getting martyred by a hobbling drunk would lead to Cibola?

My comments on Achilles tendon ruptures:

The cause is most likely jumping down from box jumps onto the ball of the foot, then immediately jumping back up. Stepping down is the way to training longevity, which would mean it is anti-@F.

@F lives in the land of inducing high cortisol, particularly raising the cortisol levels at night when the body should be repairing itself:
http://www.cortisolconnection.com/ch6_9.php

In experimental studies, cortisol has been shown to decrease levels of connective-tissue growth factors and inhibit the activity of bone-building cells (osteoblasts), muscle-building cells (satellite cells), and cartilage-building cells (chondrocytes). So here we have a situation in which excess cortisol levels not only accelerate the breakdown of connective tissues, but also interfere with the biochemical process of building and repairing those same tissues.

History of Cipro (or other quinolone antibiotic use) or cortisone injections to the area are known to weaken the tendon:
http://www.achillestendon.com/Injuries.html

Medication Side Effects
* The quinolone group of antibiotics are used to treat a wide range of bacterial infections, but weaken some people’s tendons. The weakness is most often felt in the Achilles tendon because it is one of the largest and most heavily used tendons. The weakness may be felt as Achilles tendon soreness, or if it is severe enough, can lead to a rupture. Ciprofloxacin (Cipro®, Baycip®, Cetraxal®, Ciflox®, Cifran®, Ciplox®, Cyprobay®, Quintor®) is an often prescribed member of the quinolone group. In addition to treating bacterial infections, especially urinary infections, it is also used to treat Anthrax inhalation.
* Cortisone can make a weakened Achilles tendon feel too comfortable. A patient who has received cortisone shots in or near the Achilles tendon may be able to overly stretch or strain their Achilles tendon without any pain – until they stretch or strain it to the point of rupture. Cortisone steroids should not be confused with anabolic steroids, which have a separate set of risks.

Other pertinent info from that same link:

Partial and full Achilles tendon ruptures are most likely to occur in sports requiring sudden stretching, such as sprinting and racquet sports. Partial Achilles tendon tears are also common among middle and long distance runners. Achilles tendon ruptures can happen to anyone, but are most likely to occur to middle age athletes who have not been training or who have been doing relatively little training.

Why So Many Achilles Tendon Injuries?
It is not yet known why the Achilles tendon is especially susceptible to degeneration. Some believe that it may be due to the whipping action or bowstring effect caused by ankle pronation, some believe it is the Achilles tendon's relatively weak blood supply, and some believe that it may be the combination and frequency of eccentric shortening when the heel hits the ground followed rapidly by concentric contraction when the toes push off. More research would be helpful.

@Fers should be happy now. They are FINALLY contributing to some needed research on Achilles tendon rupture!

Considering how many people are participating in the Gaymes, how many have any combo of:

• High cortisol levels
• History of Cipro
• History of cortisone injections for Achilles tendonitis, particularly returning to athletics immediately or soon after the injection
• History of oral corticosteroids
• Box jumping with jumping down at high reps (eccentric rapidly followed by concentric)
• Have valgus collapse (knees cave inward due to foot pronation) at the bottom of high impact, high fatigue activities like box jumps in an @F workout
• Middle-aged folks returning to athletic activities too intensely, too quickly (isn't that their target market?!?)

Honestly, I don't think @F will ever publish any actual studies as no IRB would say that this is safe or healthy.

I've been gone too long. Is couch selling acid now?

http://media.crossfit.com/cf-video/Cros ... heBlog.wmv

Shit, Barky's Zoning. On the way to bones and silicone. RIP.

sanchezero wrote:i feel the need to see her assets unfettered to accurately gauge their resistance to gravity.

Couldn't agree more. Couldn't she do just ONE photo session topless for us??

sanchezero wrote:

Danny John wrote:Shaf is right, but there is the other side of the issue, too: what is the benefit of Box Jumps? Oh, I know all the guys who sell them and write "cutting edge" articles will tell you x, y and z, but, honestly, the kids who jump well do Box Jumps well and the kids who don't get hurt.

So, Box Jumps. I get it. But, I don't see the benefit to the cost.

so, all crackfit hate aside, are box jumps worth a damn for training to jump higher? (assuming you don't injure yourself)

i ask because i'm one of those guys that can easily jump 4-6 inches into the air on demand and while 95% of the time i could care less, i have it in the back of my head that someday i'll work on this particular weakness. of course, i was figuring i could just add box jumps to my routine and achieve a 5 foot vert.

I've recently incorporated jumping into my program to develop power and speed. There's plenty about it in my training log.

I was trying to use proper Olympic lifting to up the power (and acquire a cool skill), but I wasn't making much headway after a few months. My squat training suffered because of the focus on learning the lifts and I didn't get any stronger or bigger or more powerful or faster and had only added a couple of kilos to my classic lifts. I decided just to do weighted and unweighted jumps to complement basic heavy squatting and deadlifting.

If this is a matter of cost/benefit, then jumps are better for me. My wingspan is eight inches greater than my standing height and I have really long legs compared to my torso. I'm built to deadift, not Olympic lift. I was busting my hump with the O-lifts and it was taking a lot of energy away from my squat training. I was stagnating at squats and not getting any benefit from the O-lifts (though I was having fun with them). Other trainees will get more benefit from O-lifting than I did, but I think jumps are better for me.

Now I do squat jumps with 30% of max squat weight for a few doubles and triples before I squat on Mondays, jump onto boxes and sprint in the middle of the week, and then do some paused/lightly weighted jumps before deadlifts on Friday. I just started this, but I'm already feeling more agile and mobile than I did when I was just squatting and deadlifting last year. These jumps are low volume and just a very simple means of teaching my nervous system to turn this "slow" strength I'm building into quick movements. I know from experience that the ability to jump high or turn on strength quickly is something that you can lose as you get stronger if you don't practice jumping and turning on strength quickly.

BUT box jumping for time is even more dipshit stupid than doing Olympic lifts for time. I train my jumps the same way I would the Olympic lifts: when fresh and with sufficient rest between very low rep sets of singles, doubles and triples. I am constantly trying to set new personal bests for heights. I'm trying to jump higher. That will help me jump higher as you may well intuit.

Dan comes by to have dinner with my family about once or twice a month.

We recently were discussing the whole box jump and depth jump issue.

An article I had read a one of the millions of S&C sites was explaining about how much more important it is to jump off the high box and rebound up to improve veritcle. Then it went into weighted depth jumps.

Dan, being the know-it-all he is suggested that I avoid doing these. Some bullshit about a 62 year old and the chances for injury.

I'm guessing a second story jump with a 90 lb. sandbag on my shoulders may be just about right. No guts, no glory.

WildGorillaMan wrote:I'm a little surprised that nobody's posted this yet.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ8GvVEpoYg[/youtube]

3:20 is where thing go off the rails.

No comment on the lifting because it's just typical shit form during high rep @fit OL. But they did finally find something more douchy than board shorts - Skins.

I need to come up with some product that has a fairly limited market appeal to a segment of specialized athletes, charge several times what any sane person who works for their money would pay for it, then find a way to infiltrate the @fit crowd. Ka-ching.