IGX

D'Aquisto wrote:Greatest overall cyclist?

Which rider has world championships and Olympic gold in three different cycling disciplines? It's none of those dudes.

And yet...Merckx is the greatest without question.

Olympic Gold in cycling is not even a blip compared to winning a single classic race let alone all of them twice.

Plus..well roundedness is a metric for crossfitters, not athletes.

Cayenne wrote:I never followed the LA story in detail, just the headlines. Issues of PED usage -right or wrong?- aside, there is one part that always struck me as just plain wrong, if I understand it correctly. Please correct me if I'm mistaken:

OK, I get that LA denied usage and called his accusers liars. I get all that. But did he also, using the great resources available to him, commence law suits against his accusers and make their lives miserable / cause them serious financial harm, to further advance his position of denial ?

Business is war without killing people directly.

Most of these were other cyclist and also dirty trying to take him down.

So Goddamn right he did everything to fuck them over, good!

Blaidd Drwg wrote:

D'Aquisto wrote:Greatest overall cyclist?

Which rider has world championships and Olympic gold in three different cycling disciplines? It's none of those dudes.

And yet...Merckx is the greatest without question.

Olympic Gold in cycling is not even a blip compared to winning a single classic race let alone all of them twice.

Plus..well roundedness is a metric for crossfitters, not athletes.

BD loves Eddddy! BD looooves Eeeeeedy!

No. I love Sean Kelly, but he only slots at about Top 10ish.

The first TDF was won riding one of these, and so therefore that rider is the greatest ever.

Terry B. wrote:

Shafpocalypse Now wrote:So for 10 fucking years, Terry B posts gay erotica and homosexual porn on the P&B and Bruvs world. He comes over to IGx and starts talking about real topics. Fuck you Terry.

This place is so shitty that it tends to bring out the worst in folks.

BOOM

DARTH wrote: Business is war without killing people directly.

Most of these were other cyclist and also dirty trying to take him down.

So Goddamn right he did everything to fuck them over, good!

No, most of them were his former helpers (one soigneuse I remember for sure, I think a couple of the others were assorted US Postal lackeys), or sports writers who were trying to cover the story. I know that it may not fit into your Nietzschean view of the world, but it is possible to be both a great competitor and a massive dick.

Bud Charniga's gaping asshole wrote:

DARTH wrote: Business is war without killing people directly.

Most of these were other cyclist and also dirty trying to take him down.

So Goddamn right he did everything to fuck them over, good!

No, most of them were his former helpers (one soigneuse I remember for sure, I think a couple of the others were assorted US Postal lackeys), or sports writers who were trying to cover the story. I know that it may not fit into your Nietzschean view of the world, but it is possible to be both a great competitor and a massive dick.

#BOOM!!

Armstrong was great for professional cycling, his opponents and detractors notwithstanding. The last thing cycling at that time would want is credible evidence of systematic doping.

At the front of the pack, meanwhile, Armstrong barely seemed to be exerting himself. And he moved at a breathtaking pace: The Postal team hit the climb at roughly 20 miles an hour, a speed cycling teams had never attained in these conditions. The Americans chalked it up to technology and fitness—but the French, and other squads, had their suspicions. So did some members of the press.

In 04 the breathtaking pace the Postal team set led Lance to winning with an averge speed of 40.553 km/hr. By 2013 the winners speed had shrunk to an average of 40.545. Good thing they cleaned up the sport.

DARTH wrote:

Cayenne wrote:I never followed the LA story in detail, just the headlines. Issues of PED usage -right or wrong?- aside, there is one part that always struck me as just plain wrong, if I understand it correctly. Please correct me if I'm mistaken:

OK, I get that LA denied usage and called his accusers liars. I get all that. But did he also, using the great resources available to him, commence law suits against his accusers and make their lives miserable / cause them serious financial harm, to further advance his position of denial ?

Business is war without killing people directly.

Most of these were other cyclist and also dirty trying to take him down.

So Goddamn right he did everything to fuck them over, good!

Darth, I usually agree with your sensibilities, but not on this one. Yes, in actual war there are no rules. (Well, that's not really true, Geneva Convention and what not, but in real, real war, let's say like in Braveheart or "300" type situations.)

And yes, business folks like to fancy themselves as "warriors" and read Sun-Tsu (sp?) and Musashi, etc.

But a cup of Starbucks is not a sword, and unless I am mistaken, the "idea" of society, is that we exchange "complete freedom of choice/chaos" (eg, "Hey, I want your [food, girl, hut, weapon, treasure, etc., so I'll just violence you until it is mine,") for "mutually agreed restrictions/security" (eg, "OK, I won't go through the red light or drive 100 mph just b/c I can, in exchange for knowing you won't either...and you won't hit me in the head with a brick either, etc.")

So business is to war what video games are to real violence. Simulated, but with limits. One of the limits is that you don't use the court system dishonestly as a weapon. (Hey, I know people do, just like they do all restricted stuff I've mentioned. I'm just saying doing some of that, to me, is just wrong.) To the extent he is found to have done so, he should be severely punished (read $$$ awarded to victims.)

Tom wrote:

At the front of the pack, meanwhile, Armstrong barely seemed to be exerting himself. And he moved at a breathtaking pace: The Postal team hit the climb at roughly 20 miles an hour, a speed cycling teams had never attained in these conditions. The Americans chalked it up to technology and fitness—but the French, and other squads, had their suspicions. So did some members of the press.

In 04 the breathtaking pace the Postal team set led Lance to winning with an averge speed of 40.553 km/hr. By 2013 the winners speed had shrunk to an average of 40.545. Good thing they cleaned up the sport.

Tom wrote:

At the front of the pack, meanwhile, Armstrong barely seemed to be exerting himself. And he moved at a breathtaking pace: The Postal team hit the climb at roughly 20 miles an hour, a speed cycling teams had never attained in these conditions. The Americans chalked it up to technology and fitness—but the French, and other squads, had their suspicions. So did some members of the press.

In 04 the breathtaking pace the Postal team set led Lance to winning with an averge speed of 40.553 km/hr. By 2013 the winners speed had shrunk to an average of 40.545. Good thing they cleaned up the sport.

They added GPP to their training, that is obviously.

Armstrong financially ruined the lives of a bunch of Joe Schmoes. For that he is forever a bitch made faggot. If one of those poor bastards took a ball bat to his kneecaps, it would be well deserved. I personally would go with the Bas Rutten or Iron Sheik specials: knock/choke unconscious then snap lower extremities with reverse heelhooks, or put him in camel clutch break his back fuck his ass make him humble, respectively.

Herv100 wrote:Armstrong financially ruined the lives of a bunch of Joe Schmoes. For that he is forever a bitch made faggot. If one of those poor bastards took a ball bat to his kneecaps, it would be well deserved. I personally would go with the Bas Rutten or Iron Sheik specials: knock/choke unconscious then snap lower extremities with reverse heelhooks, or put him in camel clutch break his back fuck his ass make him humble, respectively.

Did he initiate? Or did they? Another words, if they were trying to bring him low, well what the fuck is money and power for? How many of you if you had money and pull would let anyone fuck with you that you could just bury? No killing, no beating people up, just "My Saul is better than your Saul, you poked your dick at me, I shoved mine up your ass. Should have picked your targets and tactics better."

I am not saying he is not a dickhead, I think he is, situationaly. He has done a lot of good, more than any of us here, so there is balance IMO.

Business is war in the sense that if someone tries to fuck you (rightly or wrongly) you take them out, business or legal wise.

My Dad was a real nice guy at first in business, brought a lot of his personal ethics into it and quickly learned that sets you up for the Fuckers of the world and can make you a Fuckee. He also learned that you have to protect your bottom line, this is how we eat so sometimes, even when morally you know the other side has the upper hand, you take them out of the situation as best you can.

Now he always said you don't go looking to be adversarial, usually you are looking to make deals where everyone does well , many times you will make some concessions and compromises that error on the side of making sure they do well enough in the deal, so in the future the relationship goes on and sometimes they do this for you. "But if they try to cheat or fuck you over, son, destroy them if you can and then it gets out that you are not to be fucked with."

This is my real Father, the former Hippie, nice guy, not my step dad, who could be considered Darth Sidious.

So when I was a Foreman, Super or PM, I was very fair to my men, I pushed them hard, but I rewarded them well and would always go to bat for them if needed too, but they also knew (by seeing me do it) that if you tried to fuck with me or fuck me over, you became the enemy, period.

That's how I went from a 23 year old Framing apprentice to running all the Metal framing, Drywall, Dryvit and 1/4 of the tenant fit outs at the Factory Stores oat Hershey in 3 months because I treated that project like it was an operation in total war.

Turdacious wrote:

Tom wrote:

At the front of the pack, meanwhile, Armstrong barely seemed to be exerting himself. And he moved at a breathtaking pace: The Postal team hit the climb at roughly 20 miles an hour, a speed cycling teams had never attained in these conditions. The Americans chalked it up to technology and fitness—but the French, and other squads, had their suspicions. So did some members of the press.

In 04 the breathtaking pace the Postal team set led Lance to winning with an averge speed of 40.553 km/hr. By 2013 the winners speed had shrunk to an average of 40.545. Good thing they cleaned up the sport.

They added GPP to their training, that is obviously.

They also took out a lot of the brutally hard stages with multiple above category climbs and the times up the major cols have totally plummeted.

Blaidd Drwg wrote:
They also took out a lot of the brutally hard stages with multiple above category climbs and the times up the major cols have totally plummeted.

Watching Froom attack during the Tour this year was totally insane. He was in the saddle and simply rode away from the group at what HAD to be nearly 30mph. NFW he's doing it any cleaner that LA did it. Or Pantani before him.

Alfred_E._Neuman wrote:

Blaidd Drwg wrote:
They also took out a lot of the brutally hard stages with multiple above category climbs and the times up the major cols have totally plummeted.

Watching Froom attack during the Tour this year was totally insane. He was in the saddle and simply rode away from the group at what HAD to be nearly 30mph. NFW he's doing it any cleaner that LA did it. Or Pantani before him.

What do you think? Good ole blood packing with a better masking protocol?

I don't know. I'm pretty sure that Sky went all in with Froom when they realized what a strong responder he is to whatever they're using. They pretty much told Wiggins to take a hike after Froom came on the scene.

And Froom is even more of a special case because of the "virus" or whatever it was he was diagnosed with. It pretty much means they don't have any real past data to compare his current values with, so his biological passport is useless.

I do know that whoever they're using as a preperatore uses very similar methods to Dr. Ferrari. Froom and Wiggins both looked like walking skeletons, and Ferrari has gone on record saying that it's much easier to get a better power/weight ratio by losing weight than by increasing power. I'm guessing it's a combination of having them drop down to the absolute lowest weight they can and using doping to just maintain power levels to pre-weight loss levels.

DARTH wrote:you poked your dick at me, I shoved mine up your ass. Should have picked your targets and tactics better."

remind me never to take lessons from you

protobuilder wrote:

DARTH wrote:you poked your dick at me, I shoved mine up your ass. Should have picked your targets and tactics better."

remind me never to take lessons from you

Like you were considering it or something.

DARTH wrote:

Herv100 wrote:Armstrong financially ruined the lives of a bunch of Joe Schmoes. For that he is forever a bitch made faggot. If one of those poor bastards took a ball bat to his kneecaps, it would be well deserved. I personally would go with the Bas Rutten or Iron Sheik specials: knock/choke unconscious then snap lower extremities with reverse heelhooks, or put him in camel clutch break his back fuck his ass make him humble, respectively.

Did he initiate? Or did they? Another words, if they were trying to bring him low, well what the fuck is money and power for? How many of you if you had money and pull would let anyone fuck with you that you could just bury? No killing, no beating people up, just "My Saul is better than your Saul, you poked your dick at me, I shoved mine up your ass. Should have picked your targets and tactics better."

I am not saying he is not a dickhead, I think he is, situationaly. He has done a lot of good, more than any of us here, so there is balance IMO.

Business is war in the sense that if someone tries to fuck you (rightly or wrongly) you take them out, business or legal wise.

My Dad was a real nice guy at first in business, brought a lot of his personal ethics into it and quickly learned that sets you up for the Fuckers of the world and can make you a Fuckee. He also learned that you have to protect your bottom line, this is how we eat so sometimes, even when morally you know the other side has the upper hand, you take them out of the situation as best you can.

Now he always said you don't go looking to be adversarial, usually you are looking to make deals where everyone does well , many times you will make some concessions and compromises that error on the side of making sure they do well enough in the deal, so in the future the relationship goes on and sometimes they do this for you. "But if they try to cheat or fuck you over, son, destroy them if you can and then it gets out that you are not to be fucked with."

This is my real Father, the former Hippie, nice guy, not my step dad, who could be considered Darth Sidious.

So when I was a Foreman, Super or PM, I was very fair to my men, I pushed them hard, but I rewarded them well and would always go to bat for them if needed too, but they also knew (by seeing me do it) that if you tried to fuck with me or fuck me over, you became the enemy, period.

That's how I went from a 23 year old Framing apprentice to running all the Metal framing, Drywall, Dryvit and 1/4 of the tenant fit outs at the Factory Stores oat Hershey in 3 months because I treated that project like it was an operation in total war.

You're compelling and humble.

Herv100 wrote:Armstrong financially ruined the lives of a bunch of Joe Schmoes. For that he is forever a bitch made faggot. If one of those poor bastards took a ball bat to his kneecaps, it would be well deserved. I personally would go with the Bas Rutten or Iron Sheik specials: knock/choke unconscious then snap lower extremities with reverse heelhooks, or put him in camel clutch break his back fuck his ass make him humble, respectively.

Innocent Joe Schmoes who were doing nothing but minding their own business and shopping drug stories to the highest bidder.

Terry B. wrote:

Herv100 wrote:Armstrong financially ruined the lives of a bunch of Joe Schmoes. For that he is forever a bitch made faggot. If one of those poor bastards took a ball bat to his kneecaps, it would be well deserved. I personally would go with the Bas Rutten or Iron Sheik specials: knock/choke unconscious then snap lower extremities with reverse heelhooks, or put him in camel clutch break his back fuck his ass make him humble, respectively.

Innocent Joe Schmoes who were doing nothing but minding their own business and shopping drug stories to the highest bidder.

Yeah, things like this tend to happen when one is a prick to all his employees, peers, and everyone he comes in contact with.

Maybe if you keep white knighting for Lance, he'll let you suck his dick