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I keep hearing about him and his books. Eisler is supposed to be an ex-spook who writes good thrillers with accurate depictions of martial arts. I loved Eric Van Lustbader and David Morrell's stuff when I was a kid so I'm wondering just how good Eisler is.

His first novel, Hard Rain, has recently been made into a movie in Japan, but trailers are hard to find.

Anyone read his stuff?

Yes, I've read four of his books in the "Rain series".

I liked them a lot...I find them very entertaining.

I read the whole Rain series. Loved it. Start reading. He created some great characters, and seems to know Japan really well. He lived there for years. Also, knows a lot about tradecraft, judo, and single malt scotch. Works all that and more into the books.

I've read all of the 'Rain' series, and they're excellent - fast-paced, technically accurate, etc. I would highly recommend them.

Just one note: If you're going to give them a shot, you should really start with Rain Fall (which is actually the first book, not Hard Rain, which is, in fact, the second), as there are some continuing characters and storyline developments and such that carry over from one book to the next.

+: Good books, entertaining. Easy and fun reads
-: Eisler sucking on Furry's Cumbath Cumditioning stuff.

The Bastard Son of the Shafman wrote:+: Good books, entertaining. Easy and fun reads
-: Eisler sucking on Furry's Cumbath Cumditioning stuff.

I was really surprised that he was into that stuff. He seems to have a good bullshit detector with so much other stuff.

Grim Hamundarson wrote:

The Bastard Son of the Shafman wrote:+: Good books, entertaining. Easy and fun reads
-: Eisler sucking on Furry's Cumbath Cumditioning stuff.

I was really surprised that he was into that stuff. He seems to have a good bullshit detector with so much other stuff.

Wow. didn't know that. I think Furry deserves a bit more credit than he gets. IMO he was the one that brought back some of the older bodyweight training initially and provided a marketing model for others in the fitness industry. Most people don't give him credit for that.

But when he sells courses like "How to Take a Crap" then it's no wonder. The man is tasteless.

So Eisler really is the real deal. I hear there's a lot of judo fighting in his books. True?

Dave Chesser wrote:

Grim Hamundarson wrote:

The Bastard Son of the Shafman wrote:+: Good books, entertaining. Easy and fun reads
-: Eisler sucking on Furry's Cumbath Cumditioning stuff.

I was really surprised that he was into that stuff. He seems to have a good bullshit detector with so much other stuff.

Wow. didn't know that. I think Furry deserves a bit more credit than he gets. IMO he was the one that brought back some of the older bodyweight training initially and provided a marketing model for others in the fitness industry. Most people don't give him credit for that.

But when he sells courses like "How to Take a Crap" then it's no wonder. The man is tasteless.

So Eisler really is the real deal. I hear there's a lot of judo fighting in his books. True?

True. A lot of judo, later books bring in BJJ. Guns and knives, even mention of kettlebells and crossfit.
Eisler has a pretty good website, just google his name. The new book- no JohnRain this time- is about to come out, and he has excerpts. And a trailer for the movie.

IMO he was the one that brought back some of the older bodyweight training initially and provided a marketing model for others in the fitness industry. Most people don't give him credit for that.

A lot of people say this, and it's just not that true. First off, it's all the shit I did as a high school wrestler (and probably anyone else who did that stuff). We didn't do hindu squats, but we did a shitload of assorted calisthenics. He basically just brought wrestling conditioning to the masses. You can see all sorts of cool stuff in "Vision Quest" too.

The marketing? He got it straight from Dan Kennedy. Furey's biggest asset is that he's a shameless self promoter and was in the perfect place at the perfect time to take advantage of the burgeoning internet fitness business. And he did, and he got rich, and his materials are still pretty much low rent and sub-par compared to the best.

Grim Hamundarson wrote:True. A lot of judo, later books bring in BJJ. Guns and knives, even mention of kettlebells and crossfit.

No kidding? Wow, that does sound good. Next Amazon order i'll pick up the first of the rain series. Thanks!

The Bastard Son of the Shafman wrote:A lot of people say this, and it's just not that true. First off, it's all the shit I did as a high school wrestler (and probably anyone else who did that stuff). We didn't do hindu squats, but we did a shitload of assorted calisthenics. He basically just brought wrestling conditioning to the masses. You can see all sorts of cool stuff in "Vision Quest" too.

Furey's biggest asset is that he's a shameless self promoter and was in the perfect place at the perfect time...

Agreed to a large extent. I did a lot of that training in the army and in MA. But neither you, nor me, nor anyone else brought it to the masses. He did. And he got rich from it. IMO he still deserves credit for that (unfortunately).

Kurt J. Wilkens wrote:I've read all of the 'Rain' series, and they're excellent - fast-paced, technically accurate, etc. I would highly recommend them.

Just one note: If you're going to give them a shot, you should really start with Rain Fall (which is actually the first book, not Hard Rain, which is, in fact, the second), as there are some continuing characters and storyline developments and such that carry over from one book to the next.

Eisler's stuff is decent - well researched, nice sense of place and character - but they are missing something that John D. MacDonald's "Travis McGee" series and Lee Child's "Reacher" novels have in abundance. I read "Hard Rain", and it was a fair read. But I'd reread MacDonald, Child and Loren Estleman's entire outputs before I'd spend money on another.

Eisler's stuff is decent - well researched, nice sense of place and character - but they are missing something that John D. MacDonald's "Travis McGee" series and Lee Child's "Reacher" novels have in abundance. I read "Hard Rain", and it was a fair read. But I'd reread MacDonald, Child and Loren Estleman's entire outputs before I'd spend money on another.

Okay, don't leave me hanging, here. What do the McGee and Reacher novels have in abundance that the Rain novel didn't?

I've read the first Reacher novel, Killing Floor, and it carried me along enough that I was able to finish it - but I found Eisler's books to move quicker (which, given my rather short attention span, is important to me). Perhaps I need to get to the subsequent Reacher novels (of which I have three, but haven't read - though my wife has) to better appreciate Child's work. In years past, largely due to living in south Florida, I've made a couple half-hearted stabs at reading Travis McGee (I have at least the first half-dozen books here somewhere - yes, I have a lot of books), but the ones I tried to read didn't so much grab me. Again, though, perhaps I should take another run at them. Estleman I've got nothing on, though I've heard the name.

Also, perhaps I should have noted intially that the first couple Rain books are good enough - but for me, the series really took off with the third one (and it is for these books - the third through the sixth - that I lavish such high praise on the series). I was glad to have muddled through the first two to get to the "good stuff."

Dave Chesser wrote:I keep hearing about him and his books. Eisler is supposed to be an ex-spook who writes good thrillers with accurate depictions of martial arts.

I thought he was less spook and more of a translator or "analyst" for the CIA in japan. I think he is less splinter cell, and more Matlock, being a lawyer and all.

His books are a good read for the shitter. They move fast, and encourage you not to sit for awhile and develop polyps or hemorrhoids. Afterward, they make great kindling.

His stuff likes to insert "current" trends like CF, which will appear dated a few years down the line. Overall, recommended if you can get it from Half, or not pay cover price for it.

Kurt J. Wilkens wrote:

Eisler's stuff is decent - well researched, nice sense of place and character - but they are missing something that John D. MacDonald's "Travis McGee" series and Lee Child's "Reacher" novels have in abundance. I read "Hard Rain", and it was a fair read. But I'd reread MacDonald, Child and Loren Estleman's entire outputs before I'd spend money on another.

Okay, don't leave me hanging, here. What do the McGee and Reacher novels have in abundance that the Rain novel didn't?

I've read the first Reacher novel, Killing Floor, and it carried me along enough that I was able to finish it - but I found Eisler's books to move quicker (which, given my rather short attention span, is important to me). Perhaps I need to get to the subsequent Reacher novels (of which I have three, but haven't read - though my wife has) to better appreciate Child's work. In years past, largely due to living in south Florida, I've made a couple half-hearted stabs at reading Travis McGee (I have at least the first half-dozen books here somewhere - yes, I have a lot of books), but the ones I tried to read didn't so much grab me. Again, though, perhaps I should take another run at them. Estleman I've got nothing on, though I've heard the name.

Also, perhaps I should have noted intially that the first couple Rain books are good enough - but for me, the series really took off with the third one (and it is for these books - the third through the sixth - that I lavish such high praise on the series). I was glad to have muddled through the first two to get to the "good stuff."

Hmm, if the good stuff in Eisler's books starts in the third book, I'm willing to give the series another try.

Estleman writes the Amos Walker detective mystery series. (He also writes Westerns, but even he can't get me into that genre). I'd start with "Motor City Blue", "Sugartown" and "Downriver" if you can find the used paperbacks somewhere.And maybe "The Witchfinder".
Walker is Philip Marlowe for modern times.

Travis McGee didn't grab me until I read "The Deadly Copper Sea", when I "got" the character and went back and read the rest of the series.

I guess the quality I like about McGee, Walker and Reachers characters is, er, "heart" and carefully hidden idealism under several layers of cynical armor. My problem with Rain is that he has heroic tendencies and a code of sorts, but he really isn't out for anyone but himself. (At least that's my read on the character.) And the internal narration is just too self conciously slick.

Then again, I like Lawrence Block's "Hitman" character, so I can't claim to be consistent.

Loren D. Estleman's Amos Walker series is beyond good. It defines the genre nowadays. It's the yardstick I measure all other private dick novels against.

Plus, most of that shit is set in Michigan and in places I know. Very infrequently does Estleman get the 'vibe' of a location wrong. He did get the Midland, MI, vibe wrong though, which made me snicker.

Okay, sounds like I need to check out Estleman.

I read the Eisler's Rain series and liked it. On that basis, I picked up the latest novel, Fault Line. It really really sucks. Don't waste your time.

John D. MacDonald is one of the greats of the genre. Read his later books, like The Lonely Silver Rain. He just got better and better. One of the things he does every once in a while is write a page or passage that is so brilliant, so well written, that it is sheer poetry. It's as if he wanted to say: "hey, look, I know I'm good at plots and character, but I can write as well as anyone out there. When I feel like it."

James Lee Burke is almost always good.

Any Elmore Leonard book after about 1987 is good. One of my favorites is City Primeval: High Noon in Detroit. The first chapter of Pagan Babies is a knock out. Great dialogue. He has some rules for writing that I like. "Don't write the parts readers skip." And "if it sounds like writing, cut it."

Rain Fall is not being promoted well. It's supposed to be out in the April-May time frame but the Japanese movie company is really dropping the ball. The movie's site runs really slowly, it's very difficult to find, no translation, and there's very little news about it. The trailer isn't even on youtube. This is so typical of Japanese companies, at least outside of the big ones like Sony. Many Japanese companies have no clue how to market overseas.

It's a shame because this might be a good movie that us Westerners might want to see. Maybe it's being set up for rare, cult status?

Anyway, it's a shame for Eisler as I'm sure he could use the exposure.