IGX

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/wor ... e16845406/

Who knew, but Venezuela has it's own Troy...

Many of the poor and lower middle class remain ardent supporters of Mr. Chavez’s socialist party and his redistribution project. “The Comandante in his 14 years of rule filled us with idealism … the idea that we are all entitled to a share will survive him,” said Henrique Ollorbes, 63, a retired firefighter whose extended family lives on a network of pensions, grants and schemes provided by the government.

...better known as useful idiots & people that can't put 2 and 2 together:

Inflation is running at over 50 per cent, a raging black market buys dollars at more than 10 times the official rate, domestic industry has all but shut down; there are critical shortages of many consumer staples, including corn flour for arepas, the national breakfast. TV stations – now all state-controlled – are full of ads that alternately denounce capitalism or show square-shouldered actors talking about how they don’t hoard and buy only what they need. Billboards boast of how socialist Venezuela has never been stronger; yet almost no one has toilet paper in their bathrooms.

Meanwhile, the safety net is starting to tatter. Production by the national oil company, Petroleos de Venezuela, S.A, or PDVSA, is declining, although the government won’t say by how much. The company is crippled by debt, has no cash to invest in operations, must operate on the posted exchange rate, and has been turned into a bizarre do-everything organization that makes jam and processed chicken, builds houses and runs neighbourhood health clinics.

Maybe a batch of cookies will keep the thieves away and sooth the nerves? That is if, if there was something to make cookies with.


BTW- remember that joke that if the Government was put in charge of the Sahara Desert, the Sahara desert would run out of sand? Well the Socialist running Venezuela are providing a real world example:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-o ... e16771856/

When Venezuelan oil minister Rafael Ramirez recently announced an ambitious new target of six million barrels per day by 2019, the state-run press heralded the imminent expansion of an industry vital to the country’s health.

But people here heard the news and rolled their eyes. After all, the last five-year plan had a goal of 5.8 million barrels a day by 2012, only to finish last year at just 2.9 million. That’s down from 3.2 million back in 2005.

Remember: "All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state." The tyrannical slogan of the Left no matter it's flavor.

States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Countries that depend on Petro dollars and suck also have what?

What could it be?


State owned Oil Companies!

3rd world countries being 3rd world countries.

Yes I Have Balls wrote:3rd world countries being 3rd world countries.

How do 3rd world countries become 2nd and 1st world countries? That answer isn't socialism.

So are you suggesting the people that inhabit third world countries are somehow inferior? Maybe even biologically defective? Dare you say; subhuman? Very in keeping with old school western progressive/Leftist beliefs.

Or is culture? The ignorant Venezuelan voter that believes the state will give them someone else's money and that the state should not only run the economy, but own most of the industries. A nation of Troy's that believe in Unicorns and Fairy Tales.

So what is it; Culture or biology? Because if it isn't culture, it's biology. Venezuela is sitting on huge natural resources, is free of outside influence and haf by all accounts a growing economy and middle class before Chavez showed up.

Batboy2/75 wrote:

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Countries that depend on Petro dollars and suck also have what?

What could it be?


State owned Oil Companies!

No.

For example, Nigeria does not have a state-owned company, or if it does it is unimportant compared to the petro companies, yet practically all the exports and expenditures are petro-fueled. They just lease out to the monster oil companies and collect revenue that way, in which case hardly anyone gets employed other than through the government.

Batboy2/75 wrote:http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/wor ... e16845406/

Who knew, but Venezuela has it's own Troy...

Many of the poor and lower middle class remain ardent supporters of Mr. Chavez’s socialist party and his redistribution project. “The Comandante in his 14 years of rule filled us with idealism … the idea that we are all entitled to a share will survive him,” said Henrique Ollorbes, 63, a retired firefighter whose extended family lives on a network of pensions, grants and schemes provided by the government.

...better known as useful idiots & people that can't put 2 and 2 together:

Inflation is running at over 50 per cent, a raging black market buys dollars at more than 10 times the official rate, domestic industry has all but shut down; there are critical shortages of many consumer staples, including corn flour for arepas, the national breakfast. TV stations – now all state-controlled – are full of ads that alternately denounce capitalism or show square-shouldered actors talking about how they don’t hoard and buy only what they need. Billboards boast of how socialist Venezuela has never been stronger; yet almost no one has toilet paper in their bathrooms.

Meanwhile, the safety net is starting to tatter. Production by the national oil company, Petroleos de Venezuela, S.A, or PDVSA, is declining, although the government won’t say by how much. The company is crippled by debt, has no cash to invest in operations, must operate on the posted exchange rate, and has been turned into a bizarre do-everything organization that makes jam and processed chicken, builds houses and runs neighbourhood health clinics.

Maybe a batch of cookies will keep the thieves away and sooth the nerves? That is if, if there was something to make cookies with.


BTW- remember that joke that if the Government was put in charge of the Sahara Desert, the Sahara desert would run out of sand? Well the Socialist running Venezuela are providing a real world example:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-o ... e16771856/

When Venezuelan oil minister Rafael Ramirez recently announced an ambitious new target of six million barrels per day by 2019, the state-run press heralded the imminent expansion of an industry vital to the country’s health.

But people here heard the news and rolled their eyes. After all, the last five-year plan had a goal of 5.8 million barrels a day by 2012, only to finish last year at just 2.9 million. That’s down from 3.2 million back in 2005.

Remember: "All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state." The tyrannical slogan of the Left no matter it's flavor.

I haven't looked into it, but is the situation the same in Finland, Norway, etc, Batboy?

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Wasn't your state was built on petro dollars?

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Wasn't your state was built on petro dollars?

Please to clarify statement your?

nafod wrote:

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Wasn't your state was built on petro dollars?

Please to clarify statement your?

Sanduskylvania

nafod wrote:

Batboy2/75 wrote:

nafod wrote:States that depend on petrol revenues for everything always suck. Plenty o' money but no jobs. Bitter fighting on how to wet everyone's beaks follows.

Countries that depend on Petro dollars and suck also have what?

What could it be?


State owned Oil Companies!

No.

For example, Nigeria does not have a state-owned company, or if it does it is unimportant compared to the petro companies, yet practically all the exports and expenditures are petro-fueled. They just lease out to the monster oil companies and collect revenue that way, in which case hardly anyone gets employed other than through the government.

Want to add up the 3rd and 2nd world nations with State owned or controlled oil industries?

Another issue you are missing is property rights. In Nigeria, the Government owns the oil, regardless of who owns the land. Plus, since they have almost no "rule of law" who owns the property is at the whim of government.

If you (as a US cutizen) discover oil in your back yard, you are going to be a wealthy man. So long as you own the land, you (or a previous owner) didn't sign away the mineral rights to your property and or local zoning laws preventing your from setting up an oil rig in your back yard. Regardless, so long as your neighbor is barred from doing the exact same thing, at least there is "rule of law" and government doesn't play favorites.

Name the Nigerian private citizen that is an oil millionaire or billionaire that isn't a government or tribal official? There is the your answer.

T>1200 wrote:

Batboy2/75 wrote:http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/wor ... e16845406/

Who knew, but Venezuela has it's own Troy...

Many of the poor and lower middle class remain ardent supporters of Mr. Chavez’s socialist party and his redistribution project. “The Comandante in his 14 years of rule filled us with idealism … the idea that we are all entitled to a share will survive him,” said Henrique Ollorbes, 63, a retired firefighter whose extended family lives on a network of pensions, grants and schemes provided by the government.

...better known as useful idiots & people that can't put 2 and 2 together:

Inflation is running at over 50 per cent, a raging black market buys dollars at more than 10 times the official rate, domestic industry has all but shut down; there are critical shortages of many consumer staples, including corn flour for arepas, the national breakfast. TV stations – now all state-controlled – are full of ads that alternately denounce capitalism or show square-shouldered actors talking about how they don’t hoard and buy only what they need. Billboards boast of how socialist Venezuela has never been stronger; yet almost no one has toilet paper in their bathrooms.

Meanwhile, the safety net is starting to tatter. Production by the national oil company, Petroleos de Venezuela, S.A, or PDVSA, is declining, although the government won’t say by how much. The company is crippled by debt, has no cash to invest in operations, must operate on the posted exchange rate, and has been turned into a bizarre do-everything organization that makes jam and processed chicken, builds houses and runs neighbourhood health clinics.

Maybe a batch of cookies will keep the thieves away and sooth the nerves? That is if, if there was something to make cookies with.


BTW- remember that joke that if the Government was put in charge of the Sahara Desert, the Sahara desert would run out of sand? Well the Socialist running Venezuela are providing a real world example:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-o ... e16771856/

When Venezuelan oil minister Rafael Ramirez recently announced an ambitious new target of six million barrels per day by 2019, the state-run press heralded the imminent expansion of an industry vital to the country’s health.

But people here heard the news and rolled their eyes. After all, the last five-year plan had a goal of 5.8 million barrels a day by 2012, only to finish last year at just 2.9 million. That’s down from 3.2 million back in 2005.

Remember: "All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state." The tyrannical slogan of the Left no matter it's flavor.

I haven't looked into it, but is the situation the same in Finland, Norway, etc, Batboy?

So Finland and Norway have price controls on almost very item in the economy and their respective governments own industries that make Jam, toilet paper, etc?

Maybe you should look it up. You'll also find that the Scandinavian countries have made a rightward turn (although slight) in their policies in the last decade.

I'm not sure I understand your point. Are you saying "socialism" is a mess, or Venezuala is a mess? Or are they one and the same?

So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

As the middle class decreases in the US of A, you think there won't be more pressure for socialist policies?

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

As the middle class decreases in the US of A, you think there won't be more pressure for socialist policies?

Don't all societies have huge class splits?

doesn't batboy live in the northwest, where he gets cheap electricity because of the bonneville power administration, a socialist program if ever there was one.

Freki wrote:

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

As the middle class decreases in the US of A, you think there won't be more pressure for socialist policies?

Don't all societies have huge class splits?

Well, there's huge and there's huger.

dead man walking wrote:doesn't batboy live in the northwest, where he gets cheap electricity because of the bonneville power administration, a socialist program if ever there was one.

Prices haven't been lower since electricity was deregulated.

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

That's a valid question only if you accept Marx' erroneous view of history.

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

That's a valid question only if you accept Marx' erroneous view of history.

What is Marx's erroneous view of history? That there are in fact class splits?

nafod wrote:

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

That's a valid question only if you accept Marx' erroneous view of history.

What is Marx's erroneous view of history? That there are in fact class splits?

That they started when he said they did and because of the reasons he said they started.

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:

Turdacious wrote:

nafod wrote:So does socialism emerge from societies with huge class splits, or does it cause them?

That's a valid question only if you accept Marx' erroneous view of history.

What is Marx's erroneous view of history? That there are in fact class splits?

That they started when he said they did and because of the reasons he said they started.

Well, I don't know when or why they started, I know that they exist, and have for some time.