Adult Ed/Career Centers

The man in black · Post by **The man in black** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:50 pm

Do these universally suck or just the ones around me? I am in one for welding, half way through a 10 month course and it sucks beyond belief. In our welding lab we receive zero instruction. We rely on each other, the internet, which looking for welding advice online is like tap dancing through a mine field and experimenting to figure shit out.

A few weeks into welding school I realized another career center had started only a week ago. I called them up, explained my situation and asked if I could sit in on a class and possibly transfer in. This school had 2 instructors who would teach every other day. So the first 5 minutes of class was spent figuring out what the other instructor had taught the day before. When he started going over weld symbols he admitted he knew nothing of weld symbols and when he started teaching it was obvious he hadn't even taken 30 minutes to review the material he was supposed to teach that day. I figured that transferring there was the equivalent of jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire and decided to stay where I was.

I complained to the instructor's boss in an intelligent manner and he said he would fix it. 2 weeks later he asked how things were going and I told him basically it moved forward a few steps but had a long way to go. He apparently interpreted this as problem solved. I took my complaints to the next step in the chain of command and she was surprised to learn the problem was still there.

What really pisses me off is I considered a very high quality school an hour away from me but decided not to since it was $7000 and didn't do financial aid.

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:47 pm

A welding instructor, for the most part, is going to be making way more money welding than he is teaching, especially in some rinky dink adult ex/community college situation...the best instructors for hands on shit usually seem to be the retired guys who are doing it to have something to do.

syaigh · Post by **syaigh** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:54 pm

The vocational high schools usually have really good instructors. My mother was principal for one such place that had an excellent program. You might have some luck inquiring with the instructors at one of those to get some better leads.

Alfred_E._Neuman · Post by **Alfred_E._Neuman** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 6:18 pm

I'm in a similar situation. I restored old British sports cars all through HS and college. Got out of the hobby when we moved a few years ago.

I've been floating around pretty aimlessly for the past couple of years so I decided to look into making a career in autos. The best school for mechanics is 3 hours from me and big $, only local stuff is community college/adult Ed level. So I looked in to an apprenticeship. Stroke of supreme luck- my wife's friend has a neighbor who owns a very reputable Mercedes repair shop and he just lost two techs. So he's willing to teach me just to take some of the load off. He said to figure on two years to feel decently competent. It's like drinking from the fire hose compared to school, but the experience is invaluable, I'm getting paid to learn, and I can decide if this is what I need to be going without spending a bunch of cash.

Maybe you could look into some similar type of apprentice deal for welding.

DikTracy6000 · Post by **DikTracy6000** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:48 pm

syaigh wrote:The vocational high schools usually have really good instructors. My mother was principal for one such place that had an excellent program. You might have some luck inquiring with the instructors at one of those to get some better leads.

Agree with this. Welding, machining, electrical, all great adult instruction in our area. Alfred's suggestions also good.

ccrow · Post by **ccrow** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 12:35 am

This story is definitely "results not typical" but that kid is making a lot of money with a two year degree!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/140-000-w ... 00082.html

One possible way to find a good program is to work backward, go to the people that are hiring welders - the places you're hoping to work after you finish - and ask them where they recruit graduates.

Mickey O'neil · Post by **Mickey O'neil** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:43 am

That's a cool story. Like I just posted on FB, what really kills me is the social stigma that you have to go to a 4 year college or else you are almost looked down on and considered stupid. The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.

Holland Oates · Post by **Holland Oates** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:48 am

The main problem with making 6 figures as a skilled laborer is that you have to travel. You're not going to make that at home. I make a damn good living but by staying local I'm losing 12 to 30 thousand dollars a year.

Turdacious · Post by **Turdacious** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:56 am

Re several of the points brought up here-- what kind of welding do you want to do and what kind of welding is in demand in your area?

Protobuilder · Post by **Protobuilder** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:33 am

I know nothing of welding but have a former colleague (MBA) who burnt out of the corporate life and decided that is what he wanted to do with his life. He went to some kind of adult ed programme in Canada (2 years, I believe) and claims that he is happier all around (though not necessarily making more money).

If you're in the US, hang on for a few months because if you are an average student, the US gov't wants to pick up the tab for you. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/09/us/po ... .html?_r=0

Batboy2/75 · Post by **Batboy2/75** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:40 am

Find a retired welding guy that welds or does metal work as a hobby.

vern · Post by **vern** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:52 am

Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.

This!

The man in black · Post by **The man in black** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:14 pm

Turdacious wrote:Re several of the points brought up here-- what kind of welding do you want to do and what kind of welding is in demand in your area?

Mig and Tig are big around here. I think I would like something outside, however I am not willing to travel a lot for work. After school I am just looking to find work wherever doesn't suck too bad and pays decent. Whatever I decide would be an ideal welding job is in my 5 year plan, not right out of school.

Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:05 pm

vern wrote:
Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.
This!

That!

Kazuya Mishima · Post by **Kazuya Mishima** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:13 pm

nafod wrote:
vern wrote:
Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.
This!
That!

Well, the lesson is don't go to Brown or Yale, and get a degree in Asian Studies.

People who go to state college and get degrees in nursing, accounting, engineering, finance are still doing fine and always will.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:45 pm

Kazuya Mishima wrote:
nafod wrote:
vern wrote:
Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.
This!
That!
Well, the lesson is don't go to Brown or Yale, and get a degree in Asian Studies.

People who go to state college and get degrees in nursing, accounting, engineering, finance are still doing fine and always will.

There's a lot of people who go to state college and get half way through nursing, accounting, engineering, finance and realize that they are there because someone else told them they needed to. They fail out and now have nothing to show but debt. See it all the time.

Turdacious · Post by **Turdacious** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 1:02 am

Kazuya Mishima wrote:
nafod wrote:
vern wrote:
Mickey O'neil wrote:The stupid motherfuckers are the ones going to a university and coming out with crippling debt and no job.
This!
That!
Well, the lesson is don't go to Brown or Yale, and get a degree in Asian Studies.

People who go to state college and get degrees in nursing, accounting, engineering, finance are still doing fine and always will.

People who went to Yale will do fine merely because they got into and graduated from Yale. The pedigree from an elite school is worth $$$.

Turdacious · Post by **Turdacious** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 1:45 am

The man in black wrote:
Turdacious wrote:Re several of the points brought up here-- what kind of welding do you want to do and what kind of welding is in demand in your area?
Mig and Tig are big around here. I think I would like something outside, however I am not willing to travel a lot for work. After school I am just looking to find work wherever doesn't suck too bad and pays decent. Whatever I decide would be an ideal welding job is in my 5 year plan, not right out of school.

IMO, in the trades, you have to wade through a lot of shit to get what you want. That's the filter they use because a lot of shitty people try and get into them-- they want to weed the guys who don't play well with others from the guys who they can depend on. The nice thing about the trades is that you can often work while going through school. Sell yourself to an employer that seems decent, don't bitch when they force you to do a lot of menial shit that's less than you're capable of, and work your ass off-- the nice thing about the trades is that employers and other tradesmen actually tend to appreciate and reward that more than they do in a lot of other sectors.

ccrow · Post by **ccrow** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 10:37 am

Turdacious wrote:IMO, in the trades, you have to wade through a lot of shit to get what you want. That's the filter they use because a lot of shitty people try and get into them-- they want to weed the guys who don't play well with others from the guys who they can depend on. The nice thing about the trades is that you can often work while going through school. Sell yourself to an employer that seems decent, don't bitch when they force you to do a lot of menial shit that's less than you're capable of, and work your ass off-- the nice thing about the trades is that employers and other tradesmen actually tend to appreciate and reward that more than they do in a lot of other sectors.

Showing my old-man-ism here but it is really easy to shine as an apprentice these days. Look at this below, any kid that can come in follow those rules will be considered a catch. It's good advice but if you read between the lines you get a sense that they aren't looking for a superman or a genius, just common sense, good work ethic and work habits, and a decent attitude.

Show up on time.
Keep accurate records of the times and places you worked.
Keep accurate inventory records if this is your job.
Stock the truck after using something.
Maintain company tools.
Constantly improve your knowledge and mechanical skill.
Clean up your work area.
Minimize mistakes.
Use scrap material where possible.
No side jobs except for your mom.
Study if enrolled in apprenticeship.
Keep up with the latest NEC and local code addendums.
Don't borrow tools or anything from other workers.
Inform the shop of changes in your contact information.
Don't bring pets, children, or friends to the job.
Don't leave early without permission.
Don't miss days.
Ask for time off well in advance.
Schedule vacation in writing. Keep a copy.
Advise job supervisor when you can not work overtime.
Only one hand work on live circuits if you're qualified.
Don't expect much in the way of gratitude from anyone.
Be pleasant to customers regardless. Or leave.
Don't quote a price to anyone for anything.
Plan your work. Work your plan.
Evaluate your work each day on the way home.
Help load and unload the trucks bringing material.
Don't use the couple top steps of a ladder.
Do every job the best way you know how.
Observe the work of other trades.
Look over electrical work where ever you can.
Read trade publications and manufacturers literature.
Attend trade shows.
Check material against invoice before signing for material.
Thank your boss for your job now and then.
If you ever get a bonus, say thanks.
Drive safely with seat belt in place.
Store material in the truck so the load will not injure you.
Tie down all ladders and other objects on the roof.
Cover material to protect it from the elements.
Wear appropriate clothing for the elements.
Have a spare set of work clothes just in case.
Keep your first aid kit stocked.
Know the location of the nearest emergency clinic.
Update your swimming and CPR skills.
Notify the supervisor when damage is caused.
Observe daily weather reports to anticipate hazardous changes.
Drink fluids to avoid heat stroke. Wear a hat in the sun.
Have several pair of dry gloves ready in winter.
Keep your job car in good working order.
Keep your hand tools in good working order.
Be truthful when responding to supervisors.
Try to get a variety of work experience.
Volunteer for a difficult job now and then.
Go along to get along.
Put everything back where you got it.
Care for your injuries. Stay healthy.
Don't take chances on ladders or scaffolding.
Don't take chances with live power.
Build up a backup set of hand tools for the day when yours are taken.
Keep secure all company material and tools.
Report unsafe equipment. Do not use unsafe equipment.
Replace hacksaw blade as often as needed.
Don't wear jewelry.
Don't antagonize or fight with other workers. Walk away.
Help other workers as needed.
Keep the radio volume at a reasonable level.
Alcohol and drugs are a no no.
Wear safety glasses and ear protection as appropriate.
Be cautious working on new buildings during lightening storms.
When lifting, observe proper back position.
If something is too heavy for you ask for help.
Wear proper foot gear to protect ankles from uneven ground.
Wear hard sole shoes where sharp objects like nails are present.
Wear a hard hat as required or where sensible.
Maintain GFCI in good working order.
Return phone calls promptly.
Turn your cell phone off unless using it is part of your job.

And for God's sake... pull your britches up to your waist and use a belt!

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Wed Jan 14, 2015 1:56 pm

ccrow wrote:
Turdacious wrote:
No side jobs except for your mom.

This made me think of pimps and man-whoring...

Turdacious · Post by **Turdacious** » Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:11 am

A few things to add to ccrow's excellent list:
Don't go to the job truck emptyhanded-- unless the job is just starting for the day, something always needs to go back.
Don't leave your assigned tools in a non company job box overnight; don't leave your personal tools in a job box overnight ever.
Some employers go cheap on the essential safety stuff. You'll be fine without it most of the time until something happens that nearly kills you. Bite the bullet and buy your own.
If you don't like mariachi music or rap, you should have gotten to the jobsite first.
Don't show up with new tool bags that look new unless you want it to be covered in drywall dust on purpose.
Check out what others use for their daily carries, but eventually make up your own mind; evaluate your daily carry every few months-- you're carrying too much shit.
Each trade has essential skills that are generally not taught in school. Shorten your learning curve by practicing that skill on your own time.
Don't assume anything's safe, especially if it was done by another company.
Mark your tools so you know which ones are yours. Dremels are good for this.

Kirk · Post by **Kirk** » Fri Jan 16, 2015 6:32 pm

How does one switch from working 70+ hours a week to something more reasonable later in life? Everyone I know who's done something like that (admittedly not a huge list) just kept it up all the way to retirement, if they ever retired, since they didn't like cutting back on the cash flow. I can admire the young guy for putting in the work but no one lays on their death bed wishing they'd have worked more. Just saying... ;)

I wish the idea of trade school or apprenticeship had been made plain to me when I was a kid. My parents point me completely towards college but I was a terrible student. It worked out as I've got a good job but I get more satisfaction looking at the buildings I helped put up during summer jobs when I was in school (decades ago) than I do with most of the work I do now.

Thud · Post by **Thud** » Fri Jan 16, 2015 6:44 pm

Out here in the suburban north east, plumbers are billing $195/hr. More than many lawyers, architects, consultants, shrinks, etc. They surely have higher expenses (trucks, insurance, inventory, employees, etc) but that blue collar is turning pretty white, and typically without the heavy school debt.

TerryB · Post by **TerryB** » Sat Jan 17, 2015 4:58 pm

I have stumbled upon this fascinating stuff called "JB Weld."

I've used it to fix all manner of things.

It will soon make welders obsolete.

ccrow · Post by **ccrow** » Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:18 pm

T>1200 wrote:I have stumbled upon this fascinating stuff called "JB Weld."

I've used it to fix all manner of things.

It will soon make welders obsolete.

THAT reminds me of another good one I'd put on the list:

If you EVER hear the words, "That ain't going nowhere" come from someone holding bailing wire, duck tape, or JB Weld, wear your hard hat at all times.

IGX

Adult Ed/Career Centers

Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers

Re: Adult Ed/Career Centers