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Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 5:42 am
by baffled
Don't be an idiot like this guy, answering some questions and skipping others. Seriously, just don't talk to the cops at all. Ever. Don't even say hi.
http://seattletimes.com/html/politics/2 ... lence.html:
WASHINGTON —
The Supreme Court says prosecutors can use a person's silence against them if it comes before he's told of his right to remain silent.

The 5-4 ruling comes in the case of Genovevo Salinas, who was convicted of a 1992 murder. During police questioning, and before he was arrested or read his Miranda rights, Salinas answered some questions but did not answer when asked if a shotgun he had access to would match up with the murder weapon.
The Fifth Amendment protects Americans against forced self-incrimination, with the Supreme Court saying that prosecutors cannot comment on a defendant's refusal to testify at trial. The courts have expanded that right to answering questions in police custody, with police required to tell people under arrest they have a right to remain silent without it being used in court.

Prosecutors argued that since Salinas was answering some questions - therefore not invoking his right to silence - and since he wasn't under arrest and wasn't compelled to speak, his silence on the incriminating question doesn't get constitutional protection.

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:52 pm
by Turdacious
Free the murderer! :rolleyes:

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 1:17 pm
by Dan Martin
Abajo con Safeway. Free all political prisoners.

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:34 am
by baffled
I'm not surprised that turd doesn't get the problem here.

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:55 am
by Turdacious
baffled wrote:I'm not surprised that turd doesn't get the problem here.
There are two problems-- one is that Salinas committed double murder. But let's just ignore that...

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 5:17 am
by baffled
Turdacious wrote:
baffled wrote:I'm not surprised that turd doesn't get the problem here.
There are two problems-- one is that Salinas committed double murder. But let's just ignore that...
Who said we're ignoring that?

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 1:18 pm
by Turdacious
baffled wrote:
Turdacious wrote:
baffled wrote:I'm not surprised that turd doesn't get the problem here.
There are two problems-- one is that Salinas committed double murder. But let's just ignore that...
Who said we're ignoring that?
I'm all for punishing abuse by law enforcement. That said, you're trying to raising the burden of proof so high that a guy like Salinas could never get convicted.

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:30 pm
by Pinky
If this guy's conviction actually hinged on the fact that he stopped talking when police asked a specific question, the state's case against him was very weak.

Re: Let's Talk About The Fifth Amendment

Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 7:48 pm
by Gin Master
I agree with the holding but not with all of the majority opinion.
He had voluntarily gone to a police station with officers to talk about the murder of two brothers in 1992. He was not under arrest, and was not in custody, so he had no right to “Miranda warnings” telling him that he had a right to silence.

He answered almost all of the officers’ questions, but simply sat silent when the officers asked him if shotgun casings found at the scene would match his gun. He acted very nervous in response, but said nothing. Prosecutors used the fact that he said nothing to help convince the jury that he was guilty.
I'm a libertarian myself, but before everyone gets too butthurt about this, consider the text of the Fifth Amendment:
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Most of the 5thA protections we are used to, like the state not being able to infer guilt based on post-Miranda silence, have come from courts. This recent decision is not an encroachment on the 5thA, just a refusal to broaden what has already been done.

BTW, prosecutors don't need to make that inference. Most jurors assume that if you didn't talk to the cops or testify, then you are guilty.